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Old 07-14-2018, 04:58 PM   #1
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Narcissistic Personality Disorder at RISK in Polygamous Families

Does this Sound familiar in the rifts of the Holy Family of Baha'u'llah's among his children and Grandchildren?

O ye that stand fast and firm in the Covenant! The Center of Sedition, the Prime Mover of mischief, Mirza Muhammad Ali, hath passed out from under the shadow of the Cause, hath broken the Covenant, hath falsified the Holy Text, hath inflicted a grievous loss upon the true Faith of God, hath scattered His people, hath with bitter rancor endeavored to hurt 'Abdu'l-Bahá and hath assailed with the utmost enmity this servant of the Sacred Threshold. Every dart he seized and hurled to pierce the breast of this wronged servant, no wound did he neglect to grievously inflict upon me, no venom did he spare but he poisoned therewith the life of this hapless one.

(Abdu'l-Baha, The Will and Testament, p. 5)

-------------------------------------------------------------
The three wives of Bahá'u'lláh were:

Nawab (Asiyih Khanum): married some time between 24 September and 22 October 1835; died 1886; seven children.
Mahd-i-'Ulya (Fatimih Khanum): born 1828; married 1849; died 1904; six children. She broke the Covenant after the Ascension of Bahá'u'lláh as did all her children. See God Passes By (Wilmette: Bahá'í Publishing Trust, 1987), chapter 15.
Gawhar Khanum: married in Baghdad; died during the Ministry of 'Abdu'l-Bahá; one child. She and her daughter both broke the Covenant after the Ascension of Bahá'u'lláh. See God Passes By, chapter 15.

(The Universal House of Justice, 1995 Oct 23, Wives of Baha'u'llah, p. 2)

------------------------------
Does it really take rocket science after getting the gist of all these findings of Narcisstic personality disorder to imagine Mahd-i-'Ulya all frustrated and insecure because she's not getting Baha'u'llah's great "Staff of authority" as often as Navvab did to say to her 7 year old son: Mirza Muhammad Al " see Abbas Effendi and the Purest Branch, and greatest holy leaf over there, all think they're better than you. They'll all try and boss you around" to give him weird deluded ideas about himself?

Last edited by ReturnofZealSeeker; 07-14-2018 at 05:22 PM.
 
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Old 07-14-2018, 05:19 PM   #2
Tony Bristow-Stagg
 
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Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Does it really take rocket science
No the first councel is this;

“O SON OF SPIRIT! My first counsel is this: Possess a pure, kindly and radiant heart, that thine may be a sovereignty ancient, imperishable and everlasting."

A heart other then this, will find many veils.

Regards Tony
 
Old 07-14-2018, 05:33 PM   #3
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Old 07-14-2018, 05:37 PM   #4
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Baha'u'llah offered this advice after we obtain a pure, kindly and radiant heart.

"O SON OF SPIRIT! The best beloved of all things in My sight is Justice; turn not away therefrom if thou desirest Me, and neglect it not that I may confide in thee. By its aid thou shalt see with thine own eyes and not through the eyes of others, and shalt know of thine own knowledge and not through the knowledge of thy neighbor. Ponder this in thy heart; how it behooveth thee to be. Verily justice is My gift to thee and the sign of My loving-kindness. Set it then before thine eyes."

True Justice is Gods Commandments unto humanity.

Regards Tony
 
Old 07-14-2018, 05:39 PM   #5
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WTF KIND OF pure,kindly, and radiant heart do you expect

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Originally Posted by tonyfish58 View Post
No the first councel is this;

“O SON OF SPIRIT! My first counsel is this: Possess a pure, kindly and radiant heart, that thine may be a sovereignty ancient, imperishable and everlasting."

A heart other then this, will find many veils.

Regards Tony
Tony,
WTF KIND OF pure,kindly, and radiant heart do you expect a child to possess when his parent is percieving the sibling or non-silbling child from a different parent as Goddamn mortal threat? Have you ever experienced or witnessed that dysfunction IN FAMILIES? have you ever thought of how that ruins someone's entire life?
 
Old 07-14-2018, 05:45 PM   #6
Tony Bristow-Stagg
 
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Tony,
WTF KIND OF pure,kindly, and radiant heart do you expect a child to possess when his parent is percieving the sibling or non-silbling child from a different parent as Goddamn mortal threat? Have you ever experienced or witnessed that dysfunction IN FAMILIES? have you ever thought of how that ruins someone's entire life? ....

My wife suffered many years of abuse and elders that would not beleive her. God bless her soul, which is pure, kindly and radiant.

It was men without a pure kindly and radiant heart that did this to her.

Love is the way. With Love a way forward can be found, without love, we perceive only the calling of our animal self.

Regards Tony
 
Old 07-14-2018, 11:34 PM   #7
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Good morning ReturnofZealSeeker

Rather than responding to every post made by yourself in this thread, separately, I will amalgamate here.

You speak of many injustices which occur. You have barely scraped the surface, and you speak without knowing what injustices those others who come here have suffered or seen. Know that no soul who carries the spark of humanity in them condones any one of these injustices, large and small.

Have you considered that the cause of all these injustices is no more than a lack of genuine spirituality? The abandonment of genuine Religion - no, not the imitations and the superstitions and the man-made dogma's, but the True Essence of the spiritual Teachings of the Founders of each of the Faiths?

Tony has, following each of your most recent posts in this thread, responded most gently and with genuine truth. Yet, what fascinates me is how you then take a truth and turn it to materialistic and personal ends.

Know that the Church of the godless must first attain ascendancy. This church has many prophets each stridently vocalising from their pulpits - some of them you have linked to from this forum. As this church gains its ascendancy, what will we see in the world?

We will see an increasing loss of morality, a deepening morass of tyranny and oppression, the decaying breath of corruption, and the anarchy of excessive liberty. With the materialistic attendant loss in spirituality will come only savagery. Is this what you want? Is this what you will support? Is this the environment in which you would bring up your own child, or wish another to bring up their child? Do you wish to see the result when science, harnessed for purely material ends, is utilised by the unrestrained oppressors and tyrants and other rulers for their own benefit at the expense of the remainder of the world's population?

122 Consider the pettiness of men’s minds. They ask for that which injureth them, and cast away the thing that profiteth them. They are, indeed, of those that are far astray. We find some men desiring liberty, and priding themselves therein. Such men are in the depths of ignorance.

123 Liberty must, in the end, lead to sedition, whose flames none can quench. Thus warneth you He Who is the Reckoner, the All-Knowing. Know ye that the embodiment of liberty and its symbol is the animal. That which beseemeth man is submission unto such restraints as will protect him from his own ignorance, and guard him against the harm of the mischief-maker. Liberty causeth man to overstep the bounds of propriety, and to infringe on the dignity of his station. It debaseth him to the level of extreme depravity and wickedness.
(Baha'u'llah, The Kitab-i-Aqdas, page 63)

The Purpose of the one true God, exalted be His glory, in revealing Himself unto men is to lay bare those gems that lie hidden within the mine of their true and inmost selves. That the divers communions of the earth, and the manifold systems of religious belief, should never be allowed to foster the feelings of animosity among men, is, in this Day, of the essence of the Faith of God and His Religion.
(Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, page 287)

The Church of the godless is the epitomy of excess liberty, and the antithesis of the purpose of the One True God.

Yet, if the Church of the godless does not gain this ascendancy, then we will not see the day when the people will, en-mass, abandon the preachings of this false church and turn to the Ever-living God and His Everlasting Faith. For the Church of the godless is a revolt against the man-made corruptions in belief and practices of the previous Faiths from their pure foundations. It will, most invaluably, and despite the corruptions and misery which it shall itself engender, help to purge society of these self-same imitations, corruptions and superstitions. And when their work is done, all will become seeing of the Light of Truth, which will lead them into the pastures of peace, harmony, love, unity, faith, Religion, and global prosperity. Science and Religion will discard their age-old animosity and work together as one, and the human species will become elevated in time to heights of glory of which we cannot even imagine.

For how better to see and recognise light than during the period of deepest darkness?

So while the Church of the godless has (is) arisen (arising) and will then later collapse, the Faith brought through the Revelation of Baha'u'llah will still be here with warm and welcoming arms. It shall have progressed well beyond it's current position and station, absolutely commensurate with the needs of that future time.

With my deep love and most warm greetings

Romane

Last edited by Romane; 07-14-2018 at 11:42 PM.
 
Old 07-15-2018, 03:23 AM   #8
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Does it really take rocket science after getting the gist of all these findings of Narcisstic personality disorder to imagine Mahd-i-'Ulya all frustrated and insecure because she's not getting Baha'u'llah's great "Staff of authority" as often as Navvab did.....
Aha? So based on your theology, we should bow down and respect the "thirst for being honored and respected" in everyone? Go on for that and you will always feel frustrated because there is always someone who won't respect you or your station. The goal for an enlightened person (or you can use another word instead of enlightened) is to come to the realization that to expect perfection, permanent attention, adoration, etc from this world is the bigest cause of depression. I do not care at all for what the narcissistic side of anyone asks from me. I am who I am and I try to do the write thing.
 
Old 07-15-2018, 11:59 AM   #9
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maybe someone else can help me?

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Originally Posted by maryamr View Post
Aha? So based on your theology, we should bow down and respect the "thirst for being honored and respected" in everyone? Go on for that and you will always feel frustrated because there is always someone who won't respect you or your station. The goal for an enlightened person (or you can use another word instead of enlightened) is to come to the realization that to expect perfection, permanent attention, adoration, etc from this world is the bigest cause of depression. I do not care at all for what the narcissistic side of anyone asks from me. I am who I am and I try to do the write thing.
I don't have a theology. The point of this Thread is to remind you of the History of your own Faith. I don't understand how polygamy is, was and always was less than optimal and ideal and a form of elitism, especially even in the lifetime of The Greatest Latest Manifestation of God, if that's what Baha'u'llah really is. I mean let's examine what I mean by the inquiry to your Administrative order some more:


" On the subject of monogamy, it is stated in note 89 of the Kitáb-i-Aqdas:

Polygamy is a very ancient practice among the majority of humanity. The introduction of monogamy has been only gradually accomplished by the Manifestations of God. Jesus, for example, did not prohibit polygamy, but abolished divorce except in the case of fornication; Muhammad limited the number of wives to four, but making plurality of wives contingent on justice, and reintroducing permission for divorce; Bahá'u'lláh, Who was revealing His Teachings in the milieu of a Muslim society, introduced the question of monogamy gradually in accordance with the principles of wisdom and the progressive unfoldment of His purpose. The fact that He left His followers with an infallible Interpreter of His Writings enabled Him to outwardly permit two wives in the Kitáb-i-Aqdas but uphold a condition that enabled 'Abdu'l-Bahá to elucidate later that the intention of the law was to enforce monogamy. 3
7
On page 39 of A Synopsis and Codification of the Kitáb-i-Aqdas it is stated that "Plurality of wives is forbidden." The note explaining this appears on page 59 and states:

8
The text of the Aqdas upholds monogamy, but as it appears also to permit bigamy, the Guardian was asked for a clarification, and in reply his secretary wrote on his behalf: "Regarding Bahá'í marriage; in the light of the Master's Tablet interpreting the provision in the Aqdas on the subject of the plurality of wives, it becomes evident that monogamy alone is permissible, since, as 'Abdu'l-Bahá states, bigamy is conditioned upon justice, and as justice is impossible, it follows that bigamy is not permissible, and monogamy alone should be practiced." The House of Justice assures you that it will pray in the Holy Shrines for your guidance as you consider the many important decisions which face you at this stage in your life.

Sincerely,
For Department of the Secretariat

(The Universal House of Justice, 1995 Oct 23, Wives of Baha'u'llah, p. 2)

You can look up more passages you want which explain that the 2nd and 3rd Wives of Baha'u'llah happened when he was either still a Shiite Muslim or a Babi and wasn't yet the manifestation of God because he was still in those dispensations all you want. My point is, polygamy still was less than optimal and ideal and this is an area where I have a hard time accepting Baha'u'llah as anything other than a hypocrit. Its like he used his children as test dummies and guinnea pigs in human experimentation gone horribly wrong? By delegating a hierarchy of his Main Squeeze Navvab and the children he knocked her up with to be subject to BRUTAL competition with the other 2 wives and THEIR children. (THE BROTHER AND SISTERS OF ANOTHER MOTHERS and their successors) That's a setup for jealousy and scarcity. If I'm ever going to be a
Bahai again I would have to accept that Abdu'l-Baha was completely aware of what his role to endure this experiment and see the pathology for what it is bunch, His stepmothers as a bunch !@#$-ing conniving bitches his step mothers brainwashing and programming and poisoning the minds of his little brothers a bunch of lies. As successor to head The Bahai Faith, Abdu'l-Baha had to discover that the hard way and affirm Monogamy is the real Law of God because his wicked little half brother was a conniving **ickhead. So I don't know if anyone else here can help me percieve the latest Greatest Manifestation of God and his lifestyle as an antiquated Persian aristocrcy filthy rich playboy without that contempt? [AT LEAST until he suffered persecution for being a Babi?] Maybe there is? I don't know. Can anyone reading these forums help me out here? I'd love to hear from you.

Last edited by ReturnofZealSeeker; 07-15-2018 at 12:25 PM.
 
Old 07-15-2018, 12:10 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
I don't have a theology. The point of this Thread is to remind you of the History of your own Faith. I don't understand how polygamy is, was and always was less than optimal and ideal and a form of elitism, especially even in the lifetime of The Greatest Latest Manifestation of God, if that's what Baha'u'llah really is. I mean let's examine what I mean by the inquiry to your Administrative order some more:


" On the subject of monogamy, it is stated in note 89 of the Kitáb-i-Aqdas:

Polygamy is a very ancient practice among the majority of humanity. The introduction of monogamy has been only gradually accomplished by the Manifestations of God. Jesus, for example, did not prohibit polygamy, but abolished divorce except in the case of fornication; Muhammad limited the number of wives to four, but making plurality of wives contingent on justice, and reintroducing permission for divorce; Bahá'u'lláh, Who was revealing His Teachings in the milieu of a Muslim society, introduced the question of monogamy gradually in accordance with the principles of wisdom and the progressive unfoldment of His purpose. The fact that He left His followers with an infallible Interpreter of His Writings enabled Him to outwardly permit two wives in the Kitáb-i-Aqdas but uphold a condition that enabled 'Abdu'l-Bahá to elucidate later that the intention of the law was to enforce monogamy. 3
7
On page 39 of A Synopsis and Codification of the Kitáb-i-Aqdas it is stated that "Plurality of wives is forbidden." The note explaining this appears on page 59 and states:

8
The text of the Aqdas upholds monogamy, but as it appears also to permit bigamy, the Guardian was asked for a clarification, and in reply his secretary wrote on his behalf: "Regarding Bahá'í marriage; in the light of the Master's Tablet interpreting the provision in the Aqdas on the subject of the plurality of wives, it becomes evident that monogamy alone is permissible, since, as 'Abdu'l-Bahá states, bigamy is conditioned upon justice, and as justice is impossible, it follows that bigamy is not permissible, and monogamy alone should be practiced." The House of Justice assures you that it will pray in the Holy Shrines for your guidance as you consider the many important decisions which face you at this stage in your life.

Sincerely,
For Department of the Secretariat

(The Universal House of Justice, 1995 Oct 23, Wives of Baha'u'llah, p. 2)

You can look up more passages you want which explain that the 2nd and 3rd Wives of Baha'u'llah happened when he was either still a Shiite Muslim or a Babi and wasn't yet the manifestation of God because he was still in those dispensations all you want. My point is, polygamy still was less than optimal and ideal and this is an area where I have a hard time accepting Baha'u'llah as anything other than a hypocrit. Its like he used his children as test dummies and guinnea pigs in human experimentation gone horribly wrong? By delegating a hierarchy of his Main Squeeze Navvab and the children he knocked her up with to be subject to BRUTAL competition with the other 2 wives and THEIR children. (THE BROTHER AND SISTERS OF ANOTHER MOTHERS and their successors) That's a setup for jealousy and scarcity. If I'm ever going to be a
Bahai again I would have to accept that Abdu'l-Baha was completely aware of what a bunch of !@#$-ing conniving bitches his step mothers were programming his little brothers a bunch of lies, but as successor he had to discover that the hard way and affirm Monogamy is the real Law of God because his wicked little half brother was a conniving **ickhead. So I don't know if anyone else here can help me percieve the latest Greatest Manifestation of God and his lifestyle as Persian rich playboy without that contmpt. Maybe there is? I don't know. Can anyone reading these forums help me out here? I'd love to hear from you.
When Baha'u'llah was in Bahji He didn't live with Navvab, the Greatest Holy Leaf, or Abdu'l-Baha, but He lived with the rest of His family.
 
Old 07-15-2018, 12:35 PM   #11
Tony Bristow-Stagg
 
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When Baha'u'llah was in Bahji He didn't live with Navvab, the Greatest Holy Leaf, or Abdu'l-Baha, but He lived with the rest of His family.
It is a great meditation to consider that the Covernant of Baha'u'llah and the wisdom of the Laws for this age were first severely tested by Baha'ullah's own family.

Through the whole unfolding process of this, Baha'u'llah kept them under His Protection, as did Abdul'baha and then Shoghi Effendi. This shows God does not interfere with our choices and gives us ample chances to implement the required change of the wisdom of Gods Laws into our lives.

It is also good to note the Laws for this age are the balance between all past laws that have now been clouded by a wayward humanity.

Regards Tony
 
Old 07-16-2018, 01:01 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
. 2)

You can look up more passages you want which explain that the 2nd and 3rd Wives of Baha'u'llah happened when he was either still a Shiite Muslim or a Babi and wasn't yet the manifestation of God because he was still in those dispensations all you want. My point is, polygamy still was less than optimal and ideal and this is an area where I have a hard time accepting Baha'u'llah as anything other than a hypocrit. Its like he used his children as test dummies and guinnea pigs in human experimentation gone horribly wrong? By delegating a hierarchy of his Main Squeeze Navvab and the children he knocked her up with to be subject to BRUTAL competition with the other 2 wives and THEIR children. (THE BROTHER AND SISTERS OF ANOTHER MOTHERS and their successors) That's a setup for jealousy and scarcity. If I'm ever going to be a
Bahai again I would have to accept that Abdu'l-Baha was completely aware of what his role to endure this experiment and see the pathology for what it is bunch, His stepmothers as a bunch !@#$-ing conniving bitches his step mothers brainwashing and programming and poisoning the minds of his little brothers a bunch of lies. As successor to head The Bahai Faith, Abdu'l-Baha had to discover that the hard way and affirm Monogamy is the real Law of God because his wicked little half brother was a conniving **ickhead. So I don't know if anyone else here can help me percieve the latest Greatest Manifestation of God and his lifestyle as an antiquated Persian aristocrcy filthy rich playboy without that contempt? [AT LEAST until he suffered persecution for being a Babi?] Maybe there is? I don't know. Can anyone reading these forums help me out here? I'd love to hear from you.

First of all, I should like to ask if you have ever been a Baha'i, because you said if you want to be a Baha'i "again". maybe it is not my business, and forgive me if I am being impolite asking this personal question; I am just curious. Leave the answer alone if you feel uncomfortable

Now on the subject of the jealousy of wives, some times ago I was listening to a lecture by a famous Persian Baha'i scholar. I do not have the text of the lecture so I cannot provide you with references. But he said something very interesting. He said, Bahaullah, from the very beginning knew that Abdul Baha was going to be a special son, the greatest support of His father, as a result, He, bahaullah, gave muchhhhh more attention to His other sons, so that they, too, could be great people. He wanted them to feel no lack of love. The man said Bahaullah would spend more time playing with His other sons than with Abdul Baha. And yet, The other Son because an enemy. We can say it was the poison his mother injected to his brain, but, as a grown up, he too, had eyes to see and brain to think. First of all, his Father had always been kind to him, and second, His father had special duties as a Manifestation, so He could not do the things ordinary father can do when they are with their sons. I, personally, give no credit to jealousy and can bring no excuses for it. People are free to chose who they are going to be. If I am born in a family of murderers and addicts, I should chose to be a different person with my free will. We also have the Hidden Word that says something like "God would never enter a heart that has the least trace of jealousy in it". Jealousy is a grievous sin; is blindness and it brings with it other things like enmity, hatred, sadness. I do not know how you are bringing justifications for jealousy while , in my idea, it cannot be justified under ANY circumstances.
As for the subject of polygamy, I am sure all my friends here have better words to say. I can only say that it has been so ordinary and so accepted in the society of Iran, that doing it would not look like a mistake. The two wives of a man could most often live together in peace and they usually would become each others' best friends.
 
Old 07-16-2018, 06:15 AM   #13
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Since you've posted the same topic on two threads, here's again my counterargument to your own:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
No matter how primitive or distant or ancient the "dispensation era" of which or what Manifestation of God or what, Polygamy is a brutal and barbaric system of reproductive competition of men against other men for sexual privileges with women. If there's a multiple husband society it seems the same vice versa. Its a form of disgusting elitism. Polygamy induces EXTREME RISKS of sibling jealousy and resentment. The Most notorious sibling rift was Abdu'l-Baha's Brother "The Center of Sedition" Mirza Muhammad Ali.
Well RoZS... you are wrong.

Polygamy ain't ideal, but it's the best system there is when you live in a society where there are more women than men.

In the past, there was provably a high rate of workplace death for men, which lead to an imbalance of men and women. Genetic testing has shown that twice as many women over the course of human history survived to a reproductive age as did men.

So I ask you, in one of any number of past societies, where there were more living women than men, what is your solution??

Do you have monogamy, and let the extra women who can't find a husband go without one forever?? That seems horribly unjust.

Polygamy seems the best way to fix that situation to me. Do you have a better solution??

Polygamy only becomes, as you put it, "a brutal and barbaric system of reproductive competition" when the number of men and women in a society are equal. Which is why modern polygamous societies are having all the problems that they are having.

But the societies of the past did not have an equal number of men and women. Men died to war and hard labor. Women were excluded from military service and most hard labor. There were more women then men. In a society with unequal numbers among the genders, monogamy causes, to borrow your wording, "a brutal and barbaric system of reproductive competition of women against other women for sexual privileges with men".

So what, if anything, is your competing solution to a society with a gender imbalance??
 
Old 07-16-2018, 12:55 PM   #14
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Quote:
Well RoZS... you are wrong.

Polygamy ain't ideal, but it's the best system there is when you live in a society where there are more women than men.
And how do you suppose that happens in the first place?

There's all sorts of clever ways to induce that deficit of men to be the great Social Darwinist "Alpha Male" who gets the privileges of polygamy:

To the victor goes the spoils:

1. Out right warfare
2. pedophile homosexual coercion
3. Forced castrations and or Eunoch recruitment campaigns to guard the harems for the remaining men with elitist penises

etc. etc. etc. take your pick of how perversions escalate
 
Old 07-16-2018, 01:02 PM   #15
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brutal "To the victor goes the spoils"

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
And how do you suppose that happens in the first place?



There's all sorts of clever ways to induce that deficit of men to be the great Social Darwinist "Alpha Male" who gets the privileges of polygamy:

To the victor goes the spoils:

1. Out right warfare
2. pedophile homosexual coercion
3. Forced castrations and Eunach recruitment campaigns to guard the harems for the remaining men with elitist penises

etc. etc. etc. take your pick of how perversions escalate in t
Quote:
Men died to war and hard labor.
exactly because they were brainwashed and exploited into being slaves through cruelty. And you talk as though that was suppose to have been normal in previous dispensations? We can all just rationalize previous dispensations as completely un-evolved and cut Baha'u'llah some slack because he was the one breaking through with something novel and new and revolutionary for His Great Era? And his lifetime is the Center of all of Humanity? I struggle to do that unless there's some kind of reconciliation for all my brothers coerced into slavery or martyred for resisting slavery.
 
Old 07-16-2018, 01:05 PM   #16
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Equal Sexes: is the natural course of biological probability and evolution

Quote:
Polygamy only becomes, as you put it, "a brutal and barbaric system of reproductive competition" when the number of men and women in a society are equal. Which is why modern polygamous societies are having all the problems that they are having.
That's the natural course of biological probability and evolution. That's natural Universal Law that's ancient long before the Kitabi- Aqdas revolving around everything.
 
Old 07-16-2018, 01:32 PM   #17
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origins of enslaving men to fight wars for Elitist men

More on the slavery that makes a scarcity of men to provoke them to fight other men for sexual privilages, and the pyramid scheme of war:


 
Old 07-17-2018, 07:58 AM   #18
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And how do you suppose that happens in the first place?
No, you don't even need those things to get a gender imbalance.

Look at the rate of men who die in the workplace compared to that of women, even today in countries where there is equal opportunity for employment.

According to the US Bureau of Labor, in 2015 there were 4,836 workplace deaths in the United States. 4,492 of those, or 93%, were men. You don't need slavery or castration or "alpha males" or what have you, all human societies thusfar in our history have been organized in such a way that the more dangerous work falls disproportionally on the males.

Culturally speaking, for biological and Darwinian reasons of the survival of the species, every human culture has developed in a way where the males of the species take the riskier carriers, because the female portion of reproduction is the more time-consuming and resource-consuming part of the equation.

It has nothing to do with modern society being more enlightened or "evolved" as you put it, but merely that we are more technologically advanced. Many societies are now advanced to the point where our workplace fatalities are ridiculously low. 4,492 men dying in 2015 is a tiny portion of the US. It causes an imbalance between the amount of men and women in that country, but it's a very small variance.

Now take away modern technology and safety. The higher and higher that the percentage of the population killed in the workplace climbs, the greater and greater the disparity between men and women grows.

There's a slight problem in that we don't know the exact percentage of people who died in the workplace in the past, because frankly no one had the ability to track such a thing in older eras, again a limit of technology. The only career-related deaths tracked in the ancient era, for example, were military deaths.

With military deaths, I can find one historian, Nathan Rosenstei, who reports about a 4% yearly mortality rate for the Roman military in the era of the early Roman Republic, this equates to 6,000 workplace related deaths from military alone each year. We have no figures on workplace fatalities for other careers, like mining and fishing, all of which were much more dangerous than our current level of technology permits.

So we can see from example in the ancient era, there were nations with more workplace death each year than the US currently has (and I can't even count the numbers dead outside of one specific career!!), yet had far less people population-wise than the US.

So what do you think that would do to the imbalance between men and women population-wise??

So how do you solve that imbalance??

You could force women to fight in wars as well and work in dangerous fields like the men. Then you have an equal amount of men and women, however that cripples a nation's population growth (as when a woman dies, your society looses not only her but all the children she might have had in the future).

You could enforce monogamy and force the excess women to be deprived of relationships forever, which also impacts your society's rate of reproduction. You've already declared it is "unfair" to make men compete over women, so I think you wouldn't choose this solution as it would be equally unfair to make women compete to get men.

Or you have polygyny. Which maximizes your society's rate of reproduction by not limiting it based on the male population.

You speak of problems with Mormon polygyny. But they implemented that system in an age when workplace deaths were greatly reduced (merely due to technology). In such a society with that level of technology, polygyny is untenable for the reasons you describe.

But in the ancient era, where there are going to be more men that die than women, what is your alternate solution?? I'm still awaiting one. Perhaps there's one out there I haven't thought up yet, but none has been presented.
 
Old 07-17-2018, 01:29 PM   #19
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Look at the rate of men who die in the workplace compared to that of women, even .
Look at the rate of which of these jobs could have safer, kinder and gentler alternatives:




Snake Milkers
Underwater Welder
Prostitutes
Oil Riggers
Steel Workers
Crab Fisherman
Bush Pilots
Microchip Manufacturers
Loggers
Bull Riders



RESEARCH HOW UNSUSTAINABLE a lot of these JOBS ARE, how they appeal to Adrenaline addicts, AND all the Alternative KINDER, GENTLER, Safer methods good for the Environment for BETTER PRODUCTIVITY AND HUMAN HEALTH! its ALL insane EXPLOITATION! Its ITS ALL PARASITISM !

Last edited by ReturnofZealSeeker; 07-18-2018 at 12:22 PM.
 
Old 07-17-2018, 10:00 PM   #20
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I'm sorry but YOUR POINT DOES NOT become more valid WHEN YOU TYPE IT like this. It just makes you sound EDGY!

Also I'd love to hear your response to what Walrus asked.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus
But in the ancient era, where there are going to be more men that die than women, what is your alternate solution?? I'm still awaiting one.
 
Old 07-18-2018, 01:14 AM   #21
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And personally, I think it has something to do with the climate. Here in Sweden we have a long, hot summer right now.

gnat
 
Old 07-18-2018, 01:33 AM   #22
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And personally, I think it has something to do with the climate. Here in Sweden we have a long, hot summer right now.

gnat
I can tell you it is the heat. Tropo season or mango madness they call it here.

Sanity is hard to find in weeks of 40+ days.

Regards Tony
 
Old 07-18-2018, 06:20 AM   #23
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First, I'll note you still haven't given me your alternative solution to gender imbalance caused by dangerous jobs.

The issues you raise are only valid if you have an alternative to propose that fixes the issue. For example, I could potentially say "The fact that people are allowed to die from cancer is a black mark against our culture", but unless I have an alternative proposal that solves the issue of people dying of cancer, my complaint has no true merit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Look at the rate of which of these jobs could have safer, kinder and genterl alternatives:
I think you're trying to propose eliminating all dangerous jobs, but that's far from realistic. All of the jobs you mention are safer than the hunter/gatherer lifestyle. All jobs have become safer and safer and safer as technology has advanced, and I'd argue all of these are safer alternatives for a world without them.

But just like your issue with polygamy in the older eras, I need to ask you what your proposed alternatives for some of the below careers are.

Because again, if you don't have an alternative the complaint is not valid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Snake Milkers
Snakes are milked to create antivenom to treat snakebites.

Is your counterproposal to stop milking snakes entirely and let people die when bit by a wild snake??

How do you solve the issue of snakebites without this career??

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Underwater Welder
What's your alternative solution here??

How do you fix underwater metal structures without this career??

Does your alternative involve allowing bridges to collapse and buildings to crumble into a dilapidated state?? What about the people who will die from bridge and building collapses??

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Oil Riggers
Fun fact: Whaling and coal mining are both more dangerous than oil rigging. Not to mention the ecological impacts of trying to switch back to whale oil. So how would eliminating this job fix anything, when we'd need to go back to much more dangerous jobs to get fuel.

Is your alternative to get rid of this fuel altogether??

Then what is your solution for people freezing to death??

Perhaps alternative energy sources and electric heating could be used, but that's not economically possible for the poorer nations of the world.

So what's your alternative solution here??

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Prostitutes
I can think of alternative solutions to this one, so I'll grant this here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Steel Workers
Steel allows us to build UP, and fit more people in less space. It's revolutionary in that regard.

Without the ability to build UP, we'd have to build out, causing our urban sprawls to be sprawl even more and encroach more on the environment.

Is massive urban sprawl your preferred alternative, or is there another alternative I'm missing??

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Crab Fisherman
Fishing itself is a very dangerous career, and has been throughout all of history. It is in fact, statistically the most dangerous career to the developed world.

And yet it is a fairly necessary food source for many regions.

What's your alternative solution to the problem of people starving to death??

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Bush Pilots
Do you want to let people lost in the wilderness die?? Are you opposed to rescue operations, because this career plays a VERY important role in search and rescue.

You might as well add firefighters to this list if you're going to add bush pilots, as they are also a career that risks life to save life.

What's your alternative solution for rescuing people??

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Microchip Manufacturers
I don't know much about this industry specifically, so what is your alternative?? Probably an easy win for you as long as you provide something, considering my lack of knowledge on the subject. Still, you must be able to propose an alternative here to secure this point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Loggers
Not having wood poses even more problems to our society than not having steel does.

What's your alternative solution to people dying of exposure?? Based on your objections to steel and wood, I can only imagine you must be opposed to the notion of housing itself...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Bull Riders
Looks like pointless entertainment to me, that could be easily replaced with something else. But it's not my culture, so perhaps I have a bias. I'll grant ya this one too.

So what are your alternatives to the above?? And remember to include the alternative to polygamy that you have that eliminates the need for all dangerous careers without reintroducing the other dangers that those careers solve.

Ultimately I think it is a completely impossible idea to eliminate all dangerous careers. Especially in the past. Thus you have to find a way to either deal with the gender imbalance workplace deaths cause. That's ultimately what you need to solve here, and you have yet to propose a solution better than polygamy, other than an impossible idea that all workplace danger could be realistically eliminated without causing more problems for the human race.

Last edited by Walrus; 07-18-2018 at 09:43 AM.
 
Old 07-18-2018, 12:34 PM   #24
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Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Loggers
Not having wood poses even more problems to our society than not having steel does.

What's your alternative solution to people dying of exposure?? Based on your objections to steel and wood, I can only imagine you must be opposed to the notion of housing itself...

Spoken as though you're not the least bit aware of "industrial hemp" and "hemp history"? You wanna be a lumberjack for a living in 2018? go right ahead.
 
Old 07-18-2018, 12:41 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Spoken as though you're not the least bit aware of "industrial hemp" and "hemp history"? You wanna be a lumberjack for a living in 2018? go right ahead.
How many forests do you knock down to grow this product? Alternatively one uses open fertile food growing areas?

The key is to find a balance in this world. Timber is a building product since man started building. How do we do this sustainably?

The key here is you are being asked to offer alternatives. Anyone can say this or that is no good, but what is the alternative offered, how is the alternative better?

Regards Tony
 
Old 07-19-2018, 06:52 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Spoken as though you're not the least bit aware of "industrial hemp" and "hemp history"? You wanna be a lumberjack for a living in 2018? go right ahead.
So you only have one alternative to propose?? Build everything out of hemp-based particle board??

And as Tony rightly points out, you're just trading cutting down trees for lumber in favor of clearcutting for farmland.
 
Old 07-19-2018, 08:14 AM   #27
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you're all getting rope-a-doped by a troll.
enjoy
 
Old 07-19-2018, 11:23 AM   #28
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you're all getting rope-a-doped by a troll.
enjoy
Nah, I don't think so. His posts on occult topics are more knowledgeable on the subjects than you're average troll bringing up the topics for the lulz. I just think he's not the best at typing out everything he has to say clearly.
 
Old 07-19-2018, 11:49 AM   #29
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you're all getting rope-a-doped by a troll.
enjoy
In the end, we are to see what is of God in all people, when I read the posts, there is light shining. Q

Regards Tony.
 
Old 07-19-2018, 02:21 PM   #30
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The point of this discourse whether or not polygamy was justified and being necessary because there was a disparity of men for them always having more dangerous jobs. The bottom line is that in many cases even those most dangerous jobs by some men are often exploitation for their adrenaline addiction and macho bravado b.s. Ever see "Most Dangerous Catch"? On the discovery channel. Ask yourself do we as a species really need crab meat to survive from the most dangerous parts of the Arctic Ocean ? I don't think so, but oh there's good money to provide for a family? you see the carrot being dangled to dupe and entice people into slavery.
The bottom line is marriage between a man and a woman, monogamous heterosexuality, is optimal and ideal anyways. Emergency circumstances and circumstances of being exploited or enslaved being the exceptions that prevent all that ideal, especially in previous dispensations of obsolete Manifestation of God's rules according to some of you Bahais here because they needed eons of suffering and hierarchical mind control psychopathic elitists pulling the strings from what some of you people are complacent to just accept as normal course of evolution? I reckon maybe? . If the Bahai Prayer which describes Marriage as a "Fortress for Well Being and Salvation" and the Bahai Marriage is exclusively monogamous heterosexual consensual between the 4 parents of such man and woman? Turn that on its head upside down at what a deprivation of this Fortress most of the history of this world really is and has been for a very long time?
 
Old 07-19-2018, 02:54 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
The bottom line is marriage between a man and a woman, monogamous heterosexuality, is optimal and ideal anyways. Emergency circumstances and circumstances of being exploited or enslaved being the exceptions that prevent all that ideal, especially in previous dispensations of obsolete Manifestation of God's rules according to some of you Bahais here because they needed eons of suffering and hierarchical mind control psychopathic elitists pulling the strings from what some of you people are complacent to just accept as normal course of evolution? I reckon maybe? . If the Bahai Prayer which describes Marriage as a "Fortress for Well Being and Salvation" and the Bahai Marriage is exclusively monogamous heterosexual consensual between the 4 parents of such man and woman? Turn that on its head upside down at what a deprivation of this Fortress most of the history of this world really is and has been for a very long time?
Maybe it is so...

But it is beyond the comprehension of

a rather mediocre

gnat
 
Old 07-20-2018, 05:31 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
The point of this discourse whether or not polygamy was justified and being necessary because there was a disparity of men for them always having more dangerous jobs. The bottom line is that in many cases even those most dangerous jobs by some men are often exploitation for their adrenaline addiction and macho bravado b.s. Ever see "Most Dangerous Catch"? On the discovery channel. Ask yourself do we as a species really need crab meat to survive from the most dangerous parts of the Arctic Ocean ? I don't think so, but oh there's good money to provide for a family? you see the carrot being dangled to dupe and entice people into slavery.
I don't believe TV is representative of reality, and advise against using that as a baseline for your worldview. Regardless, fishing in general, not just crab fishing, is the statistically most dangerous career, and yes we need it to survive, at least given the world's current levels of technology.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
The bottom line is marriage between a man and a woman, monogamous heterosexuality, is optimal and ideal anyways.
Sure, monogamy is ideal...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Emergency circumstances and circumstances of being exploited or enslaved being the exceptions that prevent all that ideal,
But that ideal has seldom been historically attainable, as I have repeatedly described and you have still yet to truly contest.

For the vast amount of human history, this moment in time now when culture-wide monogamy is possible is the exception. You've yet to show how the dangerous careers can be eliminated because you have yet to propose real solutions to any of those problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
especially in previous dispensations of obsolete Manifestation of God's rules according to some of you Bahais here because they needed eons of suffering and hierarchical mind control psychopathic elitists pulling the strings from what some of you people are complacent to just accept as normal course of evolution? I reckon maybe? .
If that's your take away then I think you're not even reading my posts, are you?? You've ignored every word, as evidenced by the fact you have still not provided alternative solutions to the myriad problems you have raised.

Arctic fishing is dangerous!! No duh. But until you explain to me how those in Iceland or Greenland are supposed to feed themselves without it, your objections to that vocation are frankly meaningless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
If the Bahai Prayer which describes Marriage as a "Fortress for Well Being and Salvation" and the Bahai Marriage is exclusively monogamous heterosexual consensual between the 4 parents of such man and woman? Turn that on its head upside down at what a deprivation of this Fortress most of the history of this world really is and has been for a very long time?
I can't understand or parse any of that despite my best efforts. Can you try writing that again in a more clear, readable, and less run-on manner??
 
Old 07-20-2018, 05:25 PM   #33
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Quote:

For the vast amount of human history, this moment in time now when culture-wide monogamy is possible is the exception. You've yet to show how the dangerous careers can be eliminated because you have yet to propose real solutions to any of those problems.
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
The bottom line is marriage between a man and a woman, monogamous heterosexuality, is optimal and ideal anyways.
Sure, monogamy is ideal...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ReturnofZealSeeker View Post
Emergency circumstances and circumstances of being exploited or enslaved being the exceptions that prevent all that ideal,
But that ideal has seldom been historically attainable, as I have repeatedly described and you have still yet to truly contest.
We don't know the "vast amount of human history". We don't know what's ever been completely "historically attainable" There are evidences of civilizations at least as technologically advanced if not far more that have all been destroyed in massive depopulation global cataclysms. And maybe we'll all get put out of our misery real soon here and can all kiss our A$$es goodbye? The population of humans could have very well been at least this high or more for all we know. Abdu'l-Baha affirms this:



Quote:
When a cycle is ended, a new cycle begins; and the old one, on account of the great events which take place, is completely forgotten, and not a trace or record of it will remain. As you see, we have no records of twenty thousand years ago, although we have before proved by argument that life on this earth is very ancient. It is not one hundred thousand, or two hundred thousand, or one million or two million years old; it is very ancient, and the ancient records and traces are entirely obliterated.

Each of the Divine Manifestations has likewise a cycle, and during the cycle His laws and commandments prevail and are performed. When His cycle is completed by the appearance of a new Manifestation, a new cycle begins. In this way cycles begin, end and are renewed, until a universal cycle is completed in the world, when important events and great occurrences will take place which entirely 161 efface every trace and every record of the past; then a new universal cycle begins in the world, for this universe has no beginning. We have before stated proofs and evidences concerning this subject; there is no need of repetition.

(Abdu'l-Baha, Some Answered Questions, p. 160)



I'm not saying dangerous careers can be eliminated, but they can be reduced.

There's a vast amount of alternative solutions of clean, green, kind, free, energy extraction methods and agricultural methods that are supressed do to greed and psychopathic insane stupidity, exploitation and slavery? They're suppressed and ignored by psychopathic predatory mindsets stuck in their RX complex Lizard brain sadomascochism. Its true. There's all sorts of different undeveloped old technologies from biodiverse permaculture instead of industrial monocutlre, Tesla Technology to the Stanley Meyer car, to Industrial Hemp, to Marko Rodin coils.

Humans have brought a world of toxic crap onto themselves because they were disobedient to Natural Creator Source Love of Life and Love of God for a very long time and they didn't give a damn or care about the Consequences THEY'RE PARASITES! THEY'RE PARASITES! THEY'RE PARASITES! , but that doesn't mean way back before recorded History and all the fuzzy haze of what little artifacts and relics we can surmise upon there wasn't a paradise world. Can that last sentence really denied by Bahais in 2018 of all people? What else do I need to explain that most dangerous hazardous occupations are a result of human greed and always were that way? Do I really need to list how insane something like Nuke plants are? Or how completely wrong most oil and coal mining is for the environment and future gnerations? Or how wrong GMO toxins are. The vast majority of people are very sick slaves answering to sicker slave masters and they bring children into this world because they're completely selfish or stupid. Do your own research.

Last edited by ReturnofZealSeeker; 07-21-2018 at 11:53 AM.
 
Old 07-20-2018, 05:30 PM   #34
Tony Bristow-Stagg
 
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Do your own research.
To be a Baha'i one has done their own research.

It is good advice and the 2nd Hidden Word of Baha'u'llah;

"O SON OF SPIRIT! The best beloved of all things in My sight is Justice; turn not away therefrom if thou desirest Me, and neglect it not that I may confide in thee. By its aid thou shalt see with thine own eyes and not through the eyes of others, and shalt know of thine own knowledge and not through the knowledge of thy neighbor. Ponder this in thy heart; how it behooveth thee to be. Verily justice is My gift to thee and the sign of My loving-kindness. Set it then before thine eyes."

The world is changing for the good as we speak, great days are ahead for humanity. We are learning much from the mistakes we have made.

Regards Tony
 
Old 07-20-2018, 05:33 PM   #35
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you're all getting rope-a-doped by a troll.
enjoy
I was just about to post the question...." Who are you?"
 
Old 07-22-2018, 12:08 PM   #36
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No, you don't even need those things to get a gender imbalance.

Look at the rate of men who die in the workplace compared to that of women, even today in countries where there is equal opportunity for employment.

According to the US Bureau of Labor, in 2015 there were 4,836 workplace deaths in the United States. 4,492 of those, or 93%, were men. You don't need slavery or castration or "alpha males" or what have you, all human societies thus far in our history have been organized in such a way that the more dangerous work falls disproportionally on the males.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
Culturally speaking, for biological and Darwinian reasons of the survival of the species, every human culture has developed in a way where the males of the species take the riskier carriers, because the female portion of reproduction is the more time-consuming and resource-consuming part of the equation.
Even with all these great front line risk takes because men don't get impregnated nor have a job to nurse and care for the babies and children, what are the great risks of altruism or foolishness that put a society in those situations where they have to the most risks? ITS MATERIAL SCARCITY! & COMPETITIVE DELUDED PERCEPTION OF SCARCITY: which IS greed and the rest of all the deadly sins!



Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
It has nothing to do with modern society being more enlightened or "evolved" as you put it, but merely that we are more technologically advanced.
You really believe that sentence of yours? With all you have available to educate yourself about man made World Crisis & calamities?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
Many societies are now advanced to the point where our workplace fatalities are ridiculously low. 4,492 men dying in 2015 is a tiny portion of the US. It causes an imbalance between the amount of men and women in that country, but it's a very small variance.
You really take those government stats seriously don't you?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
Now take away modern technology and safety. The higher and higher that the percentage of the population killed in the workplace climbs, the greater and greater the disparity between men and women grows.
Type in "Environment crisis" your favorite search engine and if you don't see "modern technology and safety" as the slow kill complete psychopathic predatory parasitism I have some beach front property to sell you, along with some bridges too.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
There's a slight problem in that we don't know the exact percentage of people who died in the workplace in the past, because frankly no one had the ability to track such a thing in older eras, again a limit of technology. The only career-related deaths tracked in the ancient era, for example, were military deaths.
There's a slight problem in that you speak as though you know the exact percentage of people who are already effectively dead in the workplace as little as 2 seconds ago in the past. THEY'RE SLAVES to their parasite jobs! Type in "Soft Kill depopulation" into your favorite search and you might get a clue who little you know. Also Type in " "UN Agenda 21", "endocrine disruptors" and many other schemes and scams.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
We have no figures on workplace fatalities for other careers, like mining and fishing, all of which were much more dangerous than our current level of technology permits.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
So what do you think that would do to the imbalance between men and women population-wise??

So how do you solve that imbalance??


Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
You could force women to fight in wars as well and work in dangerous fields like the men. Then you have an equal amount of men and women, however that cripples a nation's population growth (as when a woman dies, your society looses not only her but all the children she might have had in the future).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
You could enforce monogamy and force the excess women to be deprived of relationships forever, which also impacts your society's rate of reproduction. You've already declared it is "unfair" to make men compete over women, so I think you wouldn't choose this solution as it would be equally unfair to make women compete to get men.
Enforcing monogamy is not the same as a man voluntarily having sex with only one woman and her doing the same for the man. I guess it would be force if these women were trying to rape the man. And even if someone is completely celibate or sterile in this lifetime "deprived of relationships forever" isn't necessarily the case. You don't know what kind of relationships can occur at any time.

If you really want to breed and mate and have sex, There's no way around some kind of competition to the oldest game of mating, either committing some immoral dirty trick, evading or getting hurt by some kind of dirty immoral trick . . . if you are surrounded by people who are willing to do that and that' s what you want. Baha'u'llah had hereditary elitist penis privilages in that area. He didn't earn it. He kind of "lucked out", but he payed because 2 out of 3 were conniving bitches who caused a lot of damage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
Or you have polygymy. Which maximizes your society's rate of reproduction by not limiting it based on the male population.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
You speak of problems with Mormon polygamy. But they implemented that system in an age when workplace deaths were greatly reduced (merely due to technology). In such a society with that level of technology, polygyny is untenable for the reasons you describe.

But in the ancient era, where there are going to be more men that die than women, what is your alternate solution?? I'm still awaiting one. Perhaps there's one out there I haven't thought up yet, but none has been presented.
Build a time machine and go back to the past and find and fetch a low maintenance athletic trophy wife and bring her back to really enjoy all the "male privilege" that psychopathic modern fraudulant men hating bisexual lesbian feminists absolutely hate because she's liable to be a lot more loyal and grateful to be with me. Why not?

Last edited by ReturnofZealSeeker; 07-22-2018 at 12:31 PM.
 
Old 07-22-2018, 10:34 PM   #37
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Your arguments have downgraded to simply saying "Argh! The government stats ain't right! Dangerous jobs = SLAVES! (Even though it's necessary work)" and it's kind of funny to watch.
 
Old 07-23-2018, 08:04 AM   #38
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Even with all these great front line risk takes because men don't get impregnated nor have a job to nurse and care for the babies and children, what are the great risks of altruism or foolishness that put a society in those situations where they have to the most risks? ITS MATERIAL SCARCITY! & COMPETITIVE DELUDED PERCEPTION OF SCARCITY: which IS greed and the rest of all the deadly sins!

You really believe that sentence of yours? With all you have available to educate yourself about man made World Crisis & calamities?
Ohhhhhh.

I think from what you are saying you're one of those that believes that there isn't really material scarcity in the world and that human competition is the sole cause of scarcity.

Well that makes a lot of your posts make sense, but I'm sorry, you're going to have to prove that is the case. I suggest you prove it by going out into the woods to live a hunter/gatherer lifestyle yourself for a while and see just how easy it is.

'Cause until you prove to me that you can live a hunter-gatherer lifestyle without taking any dangerous risks, you won't convince me that polygamy was not necessary at some point in time, and until you go out and experience that lifestyle for yourself, I won't convince you on the matter either.
 
Old 07-23-2018, 08:12 AM   #39
Senior Member
 
Joined: Mar 2013
From: _
Posts: 517
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyfish58 View Post
In the end, we are to see what is of God in all people, when I read the posts, there is light shining. Q

Regards Tony.
I see a sack of horseshit, and being glorious about it won't make it anything but.
 
Old 07-23-2018, 02:48 PM   #40
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2018
From: OREGON
Posts: 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saveyist View Post
Your arguments have downgraded to simply saying "Argh! The government stats ain't right! Dangerous jobs = SLAVES! (Even though it's necessary work)" and it's kind of funny to watch.
you never offered anything to make a grade to know what you're even talking about except another context muddle
 
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