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Old 12-12-2010, 12:25 PM   #1
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Cool Concerns.. Questions.

I know the avoidence of alcohol is essential in bahai faith, and I also enjoy an occassional glass of wine.. I think it wouldn be so bad to have an every so glass a wine, without induldging or become a drunkard. I believe there are some health benifits associated.
Anyway I love the Bahai Faith, and I know the avoidence of alcohol is essential in bahai faith.. But would it be wrong to have a glass of wine here and there..

Bahai's views on Diet..I know that the islamic community avoids swine, I respect them. What are the bahai's view on diet.
 
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Old 12-12-2010, 02:42 PM   #2
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there are non-alcoholic wines lol
 
Old 12-12-2010, 03:13 PM   #3
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Lol.. I understand..gotta advoid it. Anyways, whats the diet situation?
 
Old 12-12-2010, 03:57 PM   #4
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none that i know of
 
Old 12-12-2010, 06:18 PM   #5
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Human consciousness is the apex of the evolution of life on earth. Using drugs, and alcohol is a drug, degrades human consciousness. Intoxication is a degraded state of consciousness. And the degradation is both acute and chronic, ie., permanent.

Practice harmlessness. If anything is good for human nature then we should do that, if anything is harmful to human nature then we should not do that.

Have you noticed the slums down stream from the bars and liquor stores? Alcohol and other drugs are devastating human civilization right now. They're like chemical weapons that taste really good and cause insanity and death.
 
Old 12-12-2010, 06:22 PM   #6
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Yeah.. Alcohol is forbidden and we don't used it in cooking either..that is recipes that include alcohol. If a physician actually prescribes something with alcohol in it we will follow whatever a physician orders... A prescription is formally prescribed not just a recommendation such as a glass of wine a day ..

Shoghi Effendi, in letters written on his behalf, states
that this prohibition includes not only the consumption of
wine but of "everything that deranges the mind", and he
clarifies that the use of alcohol is permitted only when it
constitutes part of a medical treatment which is implemented
"under the advice of a competent and conscientious
physician, who may have to prescribe it for the cure of some
special ailment".


(Baha'u'llah, The Kitab-i-Aqdas, p. 227)

We have no dietary restrictions however Abdul-Baha mentioned that vegetarian diets would become more common in the future.. but meat is not forbidden.

As in so many other areas, the Teachings of Bahá'u'lláh in this regard follow the golden mean: kindness toward animals is definitely upheld, vegetarianism is encouraged, hunting is regulated, but certain latitude is left to individual conscience and in practical regard to the diversity of circumstances under which human beings live. For example, the indigenous peoples of the Arctic would be hard-pressed to subsist without recourse to animal products.

(20 November 1992, written on behalf of the Universal House of Justice to an individual believer)

(The Universal House of Justice, 1998 Dec 16, Traditional practices in Africa)

"In regard to the question as to whether people ought to kill animals for food of not, there is no explicit statement in the Bahá'í Sacred Scriptures (as far as I know) in favor or against it. It is certain, however, that if man can live on a purely vegetarian diet and thus avoid killing animals, it would be much preferable. This is, however, a very controversial question and the Bahá'ís are free to express their views on it."

(From a letter written on behalf of Shoghi Effendi to an individual believer, July 9, 1931)

(Compilations, Lights of Guidance, p. 296)

'Abdu'l-Bahá has indicated that in the future human beings will be vegetarians, but abstention from eating meat is not a law of this Dispensation. The laws of God are attuned to the needs and possibilities of each age.

(The Universal House of Justice, 1998 Dec 16, Traditional practices in Africa)
 
Old 12-12-2010, 06:33 PM   #7
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I can't tell you where I read it, but I'm sure I read somewhere in Baha'u'llah's Writings: Him saying to go ahead and eat meat.

There is also the later writings that mentions that vegatarianism is an acceptable diet if one wants to practice it. I would not say it is encouraged, just accepted.

Treating animals humanely is definitely a Baha'i principle. The industrial scale agriculture is not treating animals humanely. Keeping animals penned up in their own sewer, so they can't move in order to create the best lean meat is not humane. And grass fed cattle is the best cattle anyway.

Raising meat is not the most efficient way to produce food. However, raising meat on marginal farmland, that is not good land for raising grain, is efficient land use. And human beings have been omnivorous ever since we diverged from the animal kingdom 5 or 10 million years ago.
 
Old 12-12-2010, 11:52 PM   #8
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Thank you for the feedback and I understand the princlpes involved with following the Bahai way. Avoidence of drugs and alchol.. I have to be honest that I have been smoking marijuana and drinking on occasions and I relize I need to stop not only for personal reasons but as well with the dedication on following Bahai. I come from an Italian Rroman Catholic hertiage, once I began reading the Holy scriptures, books, I began getting involved with Holy Mass, Confession, and the Sacraments involved with the faith. Doing so I became facinated, astonished, there are no words describing my love for God. So I began reading books, and researching other religions and I came to the conclusion that there is none other than One True God through the manifestations before I even began my journey as a Bahai... Which led me to Bahai, I became so excited, and amazed by the writings of Bahai and I accepted Bahai as the messenger from God to the people here today. Being from an Italian/Catholic backround I feel it is necassary to build what I learned from the Catholic Religion thru the teachings of Jesus Christ and furthering my journey with God with Bahai. My parents doesn't understand/ know the religion at all and see no reason to convert to Bahai. I told them a little about the faith, "the oneness", the continuing belief of Jesus Chris, his birth, death, and ressurrection and they were cool.. I also believe that Iam my own man and have the right to choose any faith I want.. anyways.. I would love to know bahai's terms of confession/renewth of self/soul..

And in order to become a bahai how would one become one.. as I would love to consider myself a bahai right now...
I accept bahai as a prophet/messenger..

I dont want to say I'm leaving the catholic/christian faith behind.. I wanna feel/say im advancing, evolving to the teachings of the new messenger from god.. Bahai..

Anyways, peace and blessings and would love feedback/help
 
Old 12-13-2010, 07:40 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mdef View Post
I believe there are some health benifits associated [with wine].
It's my understanding that the benefits are from the grapes, NOT from the alcohol!

So you can still enjoy these benefits.

Peace, :-)

Bruce
 
Old 12-13-2010, 06:37 PM   #10
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You become a Baha'i by signing a declaration card. You can get one from the National Spiritual Assembly, or from your Local Spiritual Assembly. You are "born again," by reading the revelation of Baha'u'llah. Baha'u'llah is the only real teacher of the Baha'i Faith.

It is the mystical transformation of our human nature, caused by our independent investigation of the truth revealed by the Manifestation of God, that transforms us into one of the people of Baha.
 
Old 12-15-2010, 04:14 PM   #11
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I just thought of something.

My family likes seafood and fried food (we ARE Americans lol).
But what about beer battered food? The alcohol is cooked out. I can avoid it easily as its not that great and we don't have it often. But the alcohol is cooked out. Would it be forbidden then?
 
Old 12-15-2010, 09:29 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryK32 View Post
I just thought of something.

My family likes seafood and fried food (we ARE Americans lol).
But what about beer battered food? The alcohol is cooked out. I can avoid it easily as its not that great and we don't have it often. But the alcohol is cooked out. Would it be forbidden then?
Its the age old question, but the answer is always the same

The alcohol should have not been used in the batter

I have found a good thing for fish - Dip the fillet in egg and then coat it with cornflake crumbs & fry with only a little oil - Yummy

Cheers Tony
 
Old 12-15-2010, 10:02 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceDLimber View Post
It's my understanding that the benefits are from the grapes, NOT from the alcohol!

So you can still enjoy these benefits.

Peace, :-)

Bruce
The alcohol can have benifical effects such as rasing the amount of HDL cholesterol(good cholesterol) therefore cutting the risk of coronary heart disease.Another non alcoholic way to raise your HDL is to eat nuts. Of course alcohol also causes bad effects in your heart such as Cardiomyopathy, a disease of the heart muscle, is associated with high alcohol intake and can lead to a poor quality of life and premature death.

So nuts,tea,and dark fruits are a safe way to go.
 
Old 12-15-2010, 10:07 PM   #14
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I did not know that we are suppose to not eat food cooked with alcohol. That means I cannot eat a lot of my favorite dishes specially Pizza sauce cooked with a little bit of wine : (

What about flavor extracts?
 
Old 12-16-2010, 05:20 AM   #15
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Flavor extracts miss the point, which is the prohibition on alcoholic beverages!

Since flavor extracts aren't intended as beverages (and no normal person drinks them!), they aren't prohibited.

ANY use of alcoholic beverages is expressly prohibited REGARDLESS of whether or not the alcohol supposedly evaporates during cooking.

Peace,

Bruce
 
Old 12-16-2010, 05:10 PM   #16
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I think it is being intoxicated that is prohibited. I'm not sure if that includes using alcohol in cooking. I don't think you can get drunk eating food cooked in alcohol.

Human consciousness is the apex of the evolution of life on earth. Mind altering drugs degrade human consciousness. Intoxication is a degraded state of consciousness and the drugs cause permanent physiological changes in the human organism.

These altered states of consciousness and physiological changes are harmful degradations of human nature.
 
Old 12-16-2010, 05:26 PM   #17
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I don't know how widely Lights of Guidance is read or circulated but you will find the following advisories re. alcohol:

Drinking Forbidden, No Excuse to Touch It Even in Plum Pudding

"Under no circumstances should Bahá'ís drink. It is unambiguously forbidden in the Tablet of Bahá'u'lláh, that there is no excuse for them even touching it in the form of a toast, or in a burning plum pudding; in fact, in any way."

(From a letter written on behalf of the Guardian to an individual believer, March 3, 1957: Cited in a letter from the Universal House of Justice to the National Assembly of Ecuador, December 21, 1972)

1174. Cake Flavours and Extracts

"You ask whether it is permissible for the friends to use cake flavours, such as vanilla, lemon and rum flavoured extracts, as such flavours have a certain percentage of alcohol in them, and whether Bahá'ís may work in factories manufacturing such extracts.

"We have found no texts prohibiting the friends from using flavoured extracts in their food. This may be a matter for later legislation by the Universal House of Justice but for the time being the friends should be left free to do as they choose. The same principle applies to those who are employed in factories manufacturing such extracts."

(Letter from the Universal House of Justice to an individual believer, April 7, 1974)

1175. Strictly Prohibited Foods Flavoured with Alcoholic Liquors

"With reference to your question whether those foods which have been flavoured with alcoholic liquors such as brandy, rum, etc., should be classified under the same category as the intoxicating drinks, and consequently be avoided by believers, the Guardian wishes all the friends to know that such food, or beverages, are strictly prohibited."

(From a letter written on behalf of the Guardian to an individual believer, January 9, 1939)

1176. Alcohol for Home Remedies, No Instruction Allowing Its Use

"Although it is clear from the teachings that the use of alcohol is permitted if it is prescribed by a physician for treatment purposes, we have not been able to find any instructions which permit its use in the preparation of home remedies for common illnesses."

(From a letter of the Universal House of Justice to the National Spiritual Assembly of Ecuador, December 21, 1973)

1177. The Serving of Alcoholic Drinks by Bahá'ís and Bahá'í Institutions

"In response to questions raised on the permissibility of serving drinks in number of different circumstances, the Universal House of Justice has formulated the following guidelines.

"The fact that Bahá'ís themselves must not drink alcohol is abundantly clear and needs no comment here. With regard to the serving of alcohol to non-Bahá'ís:

1. No Bahá'í institution should serve alcohol to non-Bahá'ís under any circumstances.

2. If an individual Bahá'í entertaining an individual guest or a small group of guests as an official representative of the Bahá'í community, he should not serve alcohol in his own home, but must use his discretion whether or not to do so if the entertaining is taking place in a restaurant.

3. No Bahá'í should serve alcohol at any function or reception given by him, such as a wedding reception or a party to which a number of people are invited.

4. When a Bahá'í is privately entertaining a non-Bahá'í or a small group of guests in his own home, he must himself judge whether or not to serve alcohol. This will depend to a great degree on the customs of the country in which he is living, the individuals concerned, and the host's relationship to his guests. Obviously it is better for the Bahá'í not to serve alcohol if possible, but against this he must weigh the probable reaction of the guest in the circumstances which prevail and in the particular situation. In some countries there would be no problem in failing to provide alcohol to a guest; in others it would be regarded as extremely peculiar and anti-social and would immediately raise a barrier to further contact. It is not desirable to make a major issue of the matter.

5. When such private entertaining of an individual or small group of non-Bahá'ís taking place in a restaurant the same general principles as in point 4 above apply, except that in such a public place a failure to provide alcoholic drinks would be less easily understood than in a private home, and the Bahá'í must use his discretion accordingly.

6. Alcohol must not be served in a restaurant or other business which is wholly owned by Bahá'ís.

7. If a Bahá'í is employed by others in a job which involves the serving of alcohol, he is not obliged to change that employment. This is a matter left to each individual to decide in the light of his own conscience. Obviously such kind of employment vary widely from bartending to serving in a grocery in which wine is retailed. If the job requires a great deal of involvement with the serving of alcohol it is better for the Bahá'í to obtain other employment if he can."

(Guidelines prepared by the Universal House of Justice, The Serving of Alcohol Drinks by Bahá'ís and Bahá'í Institutions, attached to a letter written on behalf of the Universal House of Justice to an individual believer, January 31, 1982)

1178. A Business Partnership Between a Bahá'í and Non-Bahá'ís

"Since no explicit text or instruction of the beloved Guardian has been found on such a situation, i.e. the sale of alcoholic beverages by a business in which a Bahá'í is a partner with non- Bahá'ís, the House of Justice feels that no hard and fast rules should be drawn at the present time. This is a matter which needs to be decided in each case in the light of the spirit of the teachings and the circumstances of the case and, unless the situation is endangering the good name of the Faith, it should be left to the conscience of the believer concerned who should, of course, make every effort to dissociate himself from such an activity."

(From a letter written on behalf of the Universal House of Justice to the National Spiritual Assembly of India, October 10, 1983)

(Compilations, Lights of Guidance, p. 349)
 
Old 12-16-2010, 05:28 PM   #18
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I think it is being intoxicated that is prohibited. I'm not sure if that includes using alcohol in cooking. I don't think you can get drunk eating food cooked in alcohol.
"being intoxicated" is a relative and subjective term.

When asked about using alcohol in cooking the answer given was 'no'. I respect what you think about this and I don't necessarily disagree (it's not easy to become drunk this way) but let's try to make and keep that clear for everyone regardless of our personal opinions.
 
Old 12-17-2010, 04:43 AM   #19
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I think it is being intoxicated that is prohibited. I'm not sure if that includes using alcohol in cooking. I don't think you can get drunk eating food cooked in alcohol.
Once again, the prohibition is on the USE of alcoholic beverages AT ALL in cooking, REGARDLESS of whether or not the alcohol "boils off!"

We had a community member ask this specific question in my Baha'i community over 35 years ago and asked the US National Spiritual Assembly about it.

The NSA replied specifically that alcoholic beverages MAY NOT be used in cooking! Whether or not any alcohol would remain in the finished product is irrelevant.

So, end of story.

Peace,

Bruce
 
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