Who/what are the other Creators?

Momtazi · 08-19-2011, 01:07 AM

That is to say, the embryo passes through different states and traverses numerous degrees, until it reaches the form in which it manifests the words: “Praise be to God, the best of Creators,” . ('Abdu'l-Bahá P300 Baha’I World Faith)

This implies that there are other Creators with a capital 'C'. What is your understanding?

LordOfGoblins · 08-19-2011, 02:46 AM

God is the creator.
Then there is the natural universe that is constantly creating and destroying things within itself (man included who is in the image of God and can create intelligently). In a nutshell that is what I think..

arthra · 08-19-2011, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Momtazi

That is to say, the embryo passes through different states and traverses numerous degrees, until it reaches the form in which it manifests the words: “Praise be to God, the best of Creators,” . ('Abdu'l-Bahá P300 Baha’I World Faith)

This implies that there are other Creators with a capital 'C'. What is your understanding?

My own take on this is that it means "God is the best of creators".. People can create things ..true, but the best creator is God.

Abdul-Baha is describing a process of human life..proceeding from the embryo to the point where we as humans can praise God and say and believe that "God is the best of creators". The word is capitalized "Creators" out of respect to God and not meaning there is more than one God.

Momtazi · 08-19-2011, 06:41 AM

Thank you guys for your input....could I now ask re the following prayer by the BAB:

''...He is the Creator of the heavens and the earth and whatever lieth between them''

The full prayer is on page 152 of red American prayer book.

What is your understanding of 'whatever lieth between them'?

BruceDLimber · 08-19-2011, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Momtazi

What is your understanding of 'whatever lieth between them'?

Basically, it seems to me that if the Bab hadn't been a Divine Messenger, He would have been a geographer!

He's always saying things like "whatever lieth between," "to your left," "ahead," "below," etc.!

Regards, :-)

Bruce

arthra · 08-19-2011, 03:31 PM

Momtazi asked:

could I now ask re the following prayer by the BAB:

''...He is the Creator of the heavens and the earth and whatever lieth between them''

The full prayer is on page 152 of red American prayer book.

What is your understanding of 'whatever lieth between them'?

My response:

Just let me preface this that I can only give you my personal understanding..

This phrase refers to every thing in the physical universe ... the earths, suns, all the material we have in space that's unknown to us.. as well as the spiritual worlds.

Lqmn725 · 08-19-2011, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arthra

My own take on this is that it means "God is the best of creators".. People can create things ..true, but the best creator is God.

Abdul-Baha is describing a process of human life..proceeding from the embryo to the point where we as humans can praise God and say and believe that "God is the best of creators". The word is capitalized "Creators" out of respect to God and not meaning there is more than one God.

I agree. The quotation reminds me of the following ayah from the Qur'an: "The disbelievers schemed but God also schemed; God is the Best of Schemers." I don't take that to mean there are other divine schemers. I think it's meant to impress upon us respect for one of God's roles. Of course this is just my opinion. I don't know much of anything about grammar.

(FYI: I hope nobody gets hung up on the connotations of the word "schemer." Other translations use the word "planner" instead.)

Lqmn725 · 08-19-2011, 04:58 PM

Not sure if I made my point clearly. I meant, God is a creator and humans can be creators. I think "creator" was only capitalized out of respect. Similarly, God acts as a planner and humans can be planners. "Planner" or "schemer" is capitalized in the Qur'an, I think, out of respect in just the same way. I'm not sure if I'm expressing my thoughts clearly enough, but hopefully you get what I'm saying...

aidan · 08-19-2011, 05:52 PM

Does the term" God of gods"appear in the Old Testament?

arthra · 08-19-2011, 10:47 PM

There might be what is known as some "Henotheism" in some O.T. passages but in the Baha'i view all the Messengers of God have taught the same spiritual truths such as the Oneness of God and that in the past there were some corrupt perspectives that may have crept into some of the Holy Books..

In other words as some previous scriptures were not direct revelations but what was verbally passed down over time some distortions occurred based on say the understanding maybe of some scribes or such.

We Baha'is accept the Bible for instance as "inspired" and containing truth but also that it is not wholly accurate.

08-19-2011, 01:07 AM	#1
Momtazi Member Joined: Aug 2011 From: uk Posts: 33	Who/what are the other Creators? That is to say, the embryo passes through different states and traverses numerous degrees, until it reaches the form in which it manifests the words: “Praise be to God, the best of Creators,” . ('Abdu'l-Bahá P300 Baha’I World Faith) This implies that there are other Creators with a capital 'C'. What is your understanding?

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08-19-2011, 02:46 AM	#2
LordOfGoblins Senior Member Joined: Dec 2010 From: Australia Posts: 1,318	God is the creator. Then there is the natural universe that is constantly creating and destroying things within itself (man included who is in the image of God and can create intelligently). In a nutshell that is what I think..

08-19-2011, 06:41 AM	#4
Momtazi Member Joined: Aug 2011 From: uk Posts: 33	Thank you guys for your input....could I now ask re the following prayer by the BAB: ''...He is the Creator of the heavens and the earth and whatever lieth between them'' The full prayer is on page 152 of red American prayer book. What is your understanding of 'whatever lieth between them'?

08-19-2011, 03:31 PM	#6
arthra Senior Member Joined: Jun 2006 From: California Posts: 3,062	Momtazi asked: could I now ask re the following prayer by the BAB: ''...He is the Creator of the heavens and the earth and whatever lieth between them'' The full prayer is on page 152 of red American prayer book. What is your understanding of 'whatever lieth between them'? My response: Just let me preface this that I can only give you my personal understanding.. This phrase refers to every thing in the physical universe ... the earths, suns, all the material we have in space that's unknown to us.. as well as the spiritual worlds.

08-19-2011, 04:58 PM	#8
Lqmn725 Junior Member Joined: Jul 2011 From: USA Posts: 15	Not sure if I made my point clearly. I meant, God is a creator and humans can be creators. I think "creator" was only capitalized out of respect. Similarly, God acts as a planner and humans can be planners. "Planner" or "schemer" is capitalized in the Qur'an, I think, out of respect in just the same way. I'm not sure if I'm expressing my thoughts clearly enough, but hopefully you get what I'm saying...

08-19-2011, 05:52 PM	#9
aidan Senior Member Joined: Jul 2011 From: n ireland Posts: 413	Does the term" God of gods"appear in the Old Testament?

08-19-2011, 10:47 PM	#10
arthra Senior Member Joined: Jun 2006 From: California Posts: 3,062	There might be what is known as some "Henotheism" in some O.T. passages but in the Baha'i view all the Messengers of God have taught the same spiritual truths such as the Oneness of God and that in the past there were some corrupt perspectives that may have crept into some of the Holy Books.. In other words as some previous scriptures were not direct revelations but what was verbally passed down over time some distortions occurred based on say the understanding maybe of some scribes or such. We Baha'is accept the Bible for instance as "inspired" and containing truth but also that it is not wholly accurate.