Bahai Forums

Go Back   Baha'i Forums > Baha'i Forums > Baha'i Studies > Religion


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-05-2018, 12:22 AM   #41
Senior Member
 
maryamr's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2014
From: Blue Planet
Posts: 1,312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duane View Post
20. O SON OF SPIRIT! My claim on thee is great, it cannot be forgotten. My grace to thee is plenteous, it cannot be veiled. My love has made in thee its home, it cannot be concealed. My light is manifest to thee, it cannot be obscured.

I don't know what He means by this. People veil themselves from God all the time, Baha'u'llah Himself says this. So what does He mean that God's grace cannot be veiled? Is He talking about what will happen eventually in the afterlife? Or does He mean something else with this?
The question reminds me of a line in Rumi Masnavi. He says, the sun with all its glamour, can be veiled if we put the tip of one finger in front of our eyes. Now the sun is still there, shining; nothing can turn it off. But we veil ourselves from it. This is What Bahaullah means; God's Grace is the Sun that can never be veiled. It is us that is veiled.
 
Join Baha'i Forums


Welcome to Baha'i Forums, an open Baha'i Faith community! We welcome everyone and the community is free to join so register today and become part of the Baha'i Forums family!


Old 05-05-2018, 12:35 AM   #42
Just a member
 
Romane's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2013
From: Glenwood, Queensland, Australia
Posts: 697
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyfish58 View Post
I think this means that the unconstrained is always there. We can veil ourselves from acknowledging it, but we can never obscure the light.

I see that our veils do not prevent Gods Claim on us, does not prevent Gods Grace comming to us, prevent Gods Love reaching us, nor stop the light that shines upon us.

Regards Tony
Your words remind me of others from page 185 of Gleanings

Quote:
Meditate on what the poet hath written: “Wonder not, if my Best-Beloved be closer to me than mine own self; wonder at this, that I, despite such nearness, should still be so far from Him.”... Considering what God hath revealed, that “We are closer to man than his life-vein,” the poet hath, in allusion to this verse, stated that, though the revelation of my Best-Beloved hath so permeated my being that He is closer to me than my life-vein, yet, notwithstanding my certitude of its reality and my recognition of my station, I am still so far removed from Him. By this he meaneth that his heart, which is the seat of the All-Merciful and the throne wherein abideth the splendor of His revelation, is forgetful of its Creator, hath strayed from His path, hath shut out itself from His glory, and is stained with the defilement of earthly desires.
With most warm greetings

Romane
 
Old 05-14-2018, 10:10 AM   #43
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Ooops, I forgot last week, my busy-ness got to me.

Week 5
5/14/2018-5/20/2018
Jamál 18/175-‘Aẓamat 5/175

This week is the Arabic Verses, 21-25.

Last edited by Walrus; 05-21-2018 at 05:28 AM.
 
Old 05-14-2018, 10:17 AM   #44
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Verse 21

This one reminded me somewhat of this writing from Baha'u'llah:

"The world has never had nor does it now possess stability (thabát), notwithstanding the complaints of some unfaithful and wavering souls. But, in truth, whatever takes place is well-pleasing, for the divine wisdom has ordained it. Without His command and will, not a leaf can stir, and whatever occurs is conformable to wisdom. All must be contented with it, nay eagerly desire it. However, in some cases, such as when the sweetness of reunion [with God] gives way to the bitterness of separation and, likewise, when, by the decree of remoteness, nearness and meeting are banished--this causes sighs of sorrow and grief to be upraised and the tears to flow. Otherwise, the matter is as some of the philosophers have cited from the words of Hermes: 'It is impossible for the realm of creation to be better than it already is.'"

Verse 22

Greatness and nobility is our very destiny!!

Verse 23

A call to look for the imperishable rather than cling to the ever-changing world.

Verse 24

Continuing from the last, embrace the eternal, detach from the temporal.

Verse 25

Don't view yourself different from another in regards to wealth, since wealth is not an indicator of anything significant.
 
Old 05-15-2018, 12:19 PM   #45
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
O SON OF MAN! Upon the tree of effulgent glory I have hung for thee the choicest fruits, wherefore hast thou turned away and contented thyself with that which is less good? Return then unto that which is better for thee in the realm on high.

Does He expect us to answer His question, or is it a rhetorical question? If so, what is the answer? I think it's because we don't want to suffer, and we think we will suffer if we don't follow our selfish interests. Maybe we will suffer, but if it will get us closer to God it is worth it. But as humans we can only do this a little bit at a time, so we should not judge ourselves.
 
Old 05-15-2018, 12:56 PM   #46
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duane View Post
Does He expect us to answer His question, or is it a rhetorical question? If so, what is the answer? I think it's because we don't want to suffer, and we think we will suffer if we don't follow our selfish interests. Maybe we will suffer, but if it will get us closer to God it is worth it. But as humans we can only do this a little bit at a time, so we should not judge ourselves.
That's a very interesting and true observation.

People turn to attachment to alleviate suffering.

Or rather because they think it will alleviate suffering, since as we know from Gautama among other prophets, the attachment is the source of suffering.

If we hold on to our selfish interests, and the world is in a different state than that of our interests, we suffer. Like if we desire wealth and have none, that causes suffering, or if we desire food or comfort and have none, there arises suffering as well.

But if we don't desire those things, if we detach from them, we won't suffer in their absence.
 
Old 05-16-2018, 06:11 AM   #47
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
23. O SON OF THE SUPREME! To the eternal I call thee, yet thou dost seek that which perisheth. What hath made thee turn away from Our desire and seek thine own?

This relates very closely to what the Buddha said. He said attachment to the world causes suffering. Here Baha'u'llah is saying we shouldn't be attached to perishable things. Both agree that we shouldn't go after perishable things.
 
Old 05-21-2018, 05:30 AM   #48
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Week 6
5/21/2018-5/27/2018
‘Aẓamat 6/175-‘Aẓamat 12/175

This week is the Arabic Verses, 21-25.
 
Old 05-21-2018, 01:03 PM   #49
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Verse 26

Here we get a warning against backbiting or emphasizing the flaws of others.

There's the obvious reason not to do this, in that hypocrisy is not a trait I'd want in myself.

But taken into context with the other recent verses, perhaps there's another reason not to do this. We are told that the image of God is within us, thus it must be within others. Thus maybe a second reason not to criticize the faults of others is to do so would be criticism of God's creation, or even criticism of God Himself??

I'm not wholly sure yet.

Verse 27

Here a similar warning in the same vein.

Verse 28

Another statement about rejecting hypocrisy in another form.

Verse 29

This verse is "the Golden Rule", as repeated by many world traditions, religious and secular alike.

Verse 30

This part of verse 30, "for his face is My face" makes me sure of my earlier ideas after reading verse 26. Here we learn that, not only should we refrain from criticizing others and treat them with kindness, but we should also help them.

And the reason for treating them this way is because they too have the Light of God within them, and the Face of God.
 
Old 05-23-2018, 06:52 AM   #50
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
26. O SON OF BEING! How couldst thou forget thine own faults and busy thyself with the faults of others? Whoso doeth this is accursed of Me.

It is very negative to focus on other people's faults. One cannot be much of a friend to them then. Not only that you are not focusing on your own faults and working on them. Indeed we are accursed if we do this.

27. O SON OF MAN! Breathe not the sins of others so long as thou art thyself a sinner. Shouldst thou transgress this command, accursed wouldst thou be, and to this I bear witness.

This is the greatest sin for a Baha'i. This focuses everyone's attention on the faults of a person. It alienates people from the community.
 
Old 05-24-2018, 08:48 AM   #51
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
30. O SON OF MAN! Deny not My servant should he ask anything from thee, for his face is My face; be then abashed before Me.

There is a time when one wouldn't do this, like a person asking you to help him rob a bank. But then, he isn't God's servant then.
 
Old 05-27-2018, 11:28 AM   #52
Junior Member
 
Joined: May 2018
From: US
Posts: 14
30. O SON OF MAN! Deny not My servant should he ask anything from thee, for his face is My face; be then abashed before Me.

I think kindness is expressed with actions. In this case the words "Deny not" might mean to give him/her what he is asking for. It doesn't imply if he/she deserves it or not....what it does imply is that this person is God's servant, and some how reflects God's face, these are the two qualifiers. So is the passage talking about all of humanity being "My servant" or is it speaking of a specific type of person?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
 
Old 05-27-2018, 11:47 AM   #53
Tony Bristow-Stagg
 
tonyfish58's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2010
From: Normanton Far North Queensland
Posts: 4,303
Quote:
Originally Posted by raf1467rh View Post
30. O SON OF MAN! Deny not My servant should he ask anything from thee, for his face is My face; be then abashed before Me.

I think kindness is expressed with actions. In this case the words "Deny not" might mean to give him/her what he is asking for. It doesn't imply if he/she deserves it or not....what it does imply is that this person is God's servant, and some how reflects God's face, these are the two qualifiers. So is the passage talking about all of humanity being "My servant" or is it speaking of a specific type of person?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

This to me is a deep one. Could it be that the Servants in this passage are the Manifestations, as then this would balance this passage more in my mind. So then logically it would work on down the line of the Covenant, then finally to those that have accepted?

Then there is the thought, God grants us our hearts desires, so in a worldly sense it could also go this far to each individual. Then there would have to be a balance in Justice.

Regards Tony
 
Old 05-27-2018, 12:02 PM   #54
Junior Member
 
Joined: May 2018
From: US
Posts: 14
Tony, looking at the passage from the perspective of the Servant being a Manifestation of God does make sense to me. Is it no saying in a sense, if you deny "my Servant", it's as if you are denying God?

Raf

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
 
Old 05-27-2018, 12:39 PM   #55
Tony Bristow-Stagg
 
tonyfish58's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2010
From: Normanton Far North Queensland
Posts: 4,303
Quote:
Originally Posted by raf1467rh View Post
Tony, looking at the passage from the perspective of the Servant being a Manifestation of God does make sense to me. Is it no saying in a sense, if you deny "my Servant", it's as if you are denying God?

Raf

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
That is what I see, if you deny the Manifestation, His Law and Word, then you do reject what God has asked of us.

Now in this light, it gets very personal for all of us and the way I see it, this is our spiritual journey. This passage becomes the choices we make every day in our path of Service. What are we inspired to do by in the Examples, Writings and Advice we have been given.

Regards Tony
 
Old 05-29-2018, 06:05 AM   #56
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyfish58 View Post
This to me is a deep one. Could it be that the Servants in this passage are the Manifestations, as then this would balance this passage more in my mind. So then logically it would work on down the line of the Covenant, then finally to those that have accepted?

Then there is the thought, God grants us our hearts desires, so in a worldly sense it could also go this far to each individual. Then there would have to be a balance in Justice.

Regards Tony
I think the verse would likely go down to each individual, not specifically be talking about the Manifestations. I think this is the case because the "his face is my face" seems reminiscent of the other verses we read earlier which are not referring to Manifestations, such as "have breathed within thee a breath of My own Spirit", "within thee have I placed the essence of My light", "My light is in thee", etc.

Of course this applies to the Manifestations too, because they are among God's creation, but I think it would apply to all peoples, at least when they are asking in the capacity of "God's servant".
 
Old 05-29-2018, 06:06 AM   #57
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Week 7
5/29/2018-6/3/2018
‘Aẓamat 14/175-‘Aẓamat 19/175

This week is the Arabic Verses, 30-35...

Including my favorite, #32...
 
Old 05-29-2018, 09:57 AM   #58
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Verse 31

This one continues the theme of the verses before, that emphasized not judging others and helping others, telling us to live our lives as if we could be called for judgement at any moment.

And it also brings up a topic I love, a topic covered extensively in the next few verses: Death.

I'm a bit weird like that.

Here's an interesting question that this verse brings up. If heaven and hell are merely states of closeness or nearness to God, why is death the moment that we will "be called to give account for thy deeds"??

I think it is because of attachment. The more material things we are attached to here in this world, the more we will suffer from being parted with those things: And death parts us from the whole material.

Thus if we are detached from the material, death brings no suffering, and we are near God due to detachment: We are in a state of Heaven.

And if we are excessively attached to the material, death brings suffering through deprivation: We are in a state of Hell.

Verse 32

I love this verse. Death is not a bad thing, why mourn it? It's a lesson I first learned from Taoism, and seeing those lessons I had learned in a succinct, beautiful verse, that affirms that death is not a thing to be mourned.

Also it inverts the common stereotypes associating death with darkness, by instead equating death with light.

Verse 33

Since Verse 32 refers to death as both "a messenger of joy" and "light", when I see the phrase here in Verse 33, "With the joyful tidings of light", I can only conclude that the verse here is still talking about the subject of death, referring to it as "joyful tidings of light".

Here we are told that death is a call for us to enter "the court of holiness" to "live in peace for evermore."

Verse 34

This one is interesting because its words are a direct parallel to Verse 32, except some of the words have been changed.

It also directly challenges the idea that death is a separation, instead stating it is a reunion, and thus, again, is not a thing to mourn.

I love the inversions of common presumptions within these verses: Death is not darkness, Death is not separation, Death is light, Death is reunion!!

Verse 35

This final one continues the line of thought from the last four, wherein we learn death is not a thing to mourn, but Verse 35 takes it further, we should not mourn anything at all "save that thou art far from Us."

And then it adds we should rejoice only in nearness to God, which serves as a great transition between the last four verses, on the topic of Death, and the next set of verses (which we'll cover next week) that focuses on rejoicing in nearness to God.

Which shows some of the literary mastery of this Scripture, where each verse flows neatly from the previous and into the next.

It also reminds me of an idea discussed in the Taoist text, the Zhuang Tzu, which calls above "freeing the bond", describing a state of mind in unity with God which is free form both "joy and sorrow".
 
Old 05-30-2018, 08:02 AM   #59
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
31. O SON OF BEING! Bring thyself to account each day ere thou art summoned to a reckoning; for death, unheralded, shall come upon thee and thou shalt be called to give account for thy deeds.

He brings us to account then because after death we have no more free will to do good deeds or bad deeds. After that all our progress is obtained from God through our own and other peoples supplications to God or good deeds done in our name.

32. O SON OF THE SUPREME! I have made death a messenger of joy to thee. Wherefore dost thou grieve? I made the light to shed on thee its splendor. Why dost thou veil thyself therefrom?

I don't think this means that we shouldn't mourn our loved one's death because we miss them. But we should realize that death is a good thing for them. We should be happy too.
 
Old 05-30-2018, 09:52 AM   #60
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duane View Post
I don't think this means that we shouldn't mourn our loved one's death because we miss them.
I'd have to disagree on that for a few reasons:

Death is not a separation as we commonly view it, ideally a dead person should not be missed because we are not, in truth, separated from them, according to both ‘Abdu’l-Bahá ("Those who have ascended have different attributes from those who are still on earth, yet there is no real separation") and Muhammad ("They are alive, but you perceive it not.")

So I think, ideally, one should not mourn or even miss the dead because we are not truly separate from them at all, and can even interact with them on a spiritual level. (the key word here is ideally, I don't mean to downplay that this is not an easy task for most)

But then the more obvious reason: we should not mourn our loved ones' deaths because, as Verse 35 reads, we should "Sorrow not save that thou art far from Us." Therefore there is only one thing we should mourn at all, according to God.

Again, this is ideally speaking.

Last edited by Walrus; 05-30-2018 at 09:56 AM.
 
Old 05-30-2018, 12:30 PM   #61
Tony Bristow-Stagg
 
tonyfish58's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2010
From: Normanton Far North Queensland
Posts: 4,303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walrus View Post
So I think, ideally, one should not mourn or even miss the dead because we are not truly separate from them at all, and can even interact with them on a spiritual level. (the key word here is ideally, I don't mean to downplay that this is not an easy task for most)

But then the more obvious reason: we should not mourn our loved ones' deaths because, as Verse 35 reads, we should "Sorrow not save that thou art far from Us." Therefore there is only one thing we should mourn at all, according to God.

Again, this is ideally speaking.
For this we look at the example we were given, Abdul'baha.

Was there no grief in the Holy Families lives on the passing of a relative?

There is a balance in this to find and I would say personally that mourning in this life is part of that balance. All of us will mourn the passing of a loved one in our own ways based on our current views of Life and Faith.

Regards Tony
 
Old 05-30-2018, 06:41 PM   #62
Junior Member
 
Joined: May 2018
From: US
Posts: 14
32. .........I have made death a messenger of joy to thee. Wherefore dost thou grieve?

I look at death like rebirth. The soul is moving from this world to another more awesome and unimaginable world. Similar to when the fetus leaves the world of the womb and enters this world. What do the rest of you think? Is this the correct vision of death? If so, it would be joyous.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
 
Old 05-31-2018, 06:11 AM   #63
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyfish58 View Post
For this we look at the example we were given, Abdul'baha.

Was there no grief in the Holy Families lives on the passing of a relative?

There is a balance in this to find and I would say personally that mourning in this life is part of that balance.
Sure, it's not easy even for someone like 'Abdu'l-Baha ... but that being said, the Word of God is clear here: "Sorrow not save that thou art far from Us." That is the standard we are given and what we should strive to live up to.

Even the Taoist sage Zhuang Tzu, who wrote extensively about how death was something that should not be mourned, initially mourned when his wife died, even though he eventually realized he should not mourn her change in form: "When she died, I was in despair, as any man well might be. But soon, pondering on what had happened, I told myself that in death no strange new fate befalls us. In the beginning, we lack not life only, but form. Not form only, but spirit. We are blended in one great featureless indistinguishable mass. Then a time came when the mass evolved spirit, spirit evolved form, form evolved life. And now life in its turn has evolved death. For not nature only but man's being has its seasons, its sequence of spring and autumn, summer and winter. If someone is tired and has gone to lie down, we do not pursue him with shouting and bawling. She whom I have lost has lain down to sleep for a while in the Great Inner Room. To break in upon her rest with the noise of lamentation would but show that I knew nothing of nature's Sovereign Law. That is why I ceased to mourn."

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyfish58 View Post
All of us will mourn the passing of a loved one in our own ways based on our current views of Life and Faith.
I do not think it is true. While uncommon, maybe even extremely so, since even very holy persons have mourned death, I know of a few persons who did not mourn the cycle of change when it comes to the death of somewhere near to them.

Because of how difficult it must be to attain such a state of mind, it's not something that I think we should judge others for doing. Judging those who mourn doesn't make a whole lot of sense, since those are the majority, and their mourning is understandable given the common cultural consensus about the subject of death.

But just because it is extremely common to mourn death, and difficult perhaps to not mourn it doesn't mean, I think, that we shouldn't keep in mind that the ideal standard is to not mourn death. The ideal state, which we should strive for, is "Sorrow not save that thou art far from Us", thus we should strive not to mourn death.

Last edited by Walrus; 05-31-2018 at 06:14 AM.
 
Old 05-31-2018, 06:11 AM   #64
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Quote:
Originally Posted by raf1467rh View Post
32. .........I have made death a messenger of joy to thee. Wherefore dost thou grieve?

I look at death like rebirth. The soul is moving from this world to another more awesome and unimaginable world. Similar to when the fetus leaves the world of the womb and enters this world. What do the rest of you think? Is this the correct vision of death? If so, it would be joyous.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
I very much agree.
 
Old 05-31-2018, 11:08 AM   #65
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
33. O SON OF SPIRIT! With the joyful tidings of light I hail thee: rejoice! To the court of holiness I summon thee; abide therein that thou mayest live in peace for evermore.

I never thought of this in relation to death before, but you are right. But it also has to do with this life. At all times God is hailing us with tidings of light, we just have to experience it. He is always summoning to the court of holiness, He wants us to be holy.
 
Old 05-31-2018, 06:45 PM   #66
Junior Member
 
Joined: May 2018
From: US
Posts: 14
33. O SON OF SPIRIT! With the joyful tidings of light I hail thee: rejoice! To the court of holiness I summon thee; abide therein that thou mayest live in peace for evermore.

I think that in this life "the joyful tidings of life" that draw us are the Writings and virtues of Baha'u'llah. As we are hailed by them we are also summoned by him to live a virtous and holy life and this brings peace in this life and the next life as well.


Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
 
Old 06-01-2018, 10:33 AM   #67
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
35. O SON OF MAN! Sorrow not save that thou art far from Us. Rejoice not save that thou art drawing near and returning unto Us.

This is very hard to do.
 
Old 06-05-2018, 05:31 AM   #68
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Week 8
6/4/2018-6/10/2018
‘Aẓamat 19/175-Núr 6/175

This week is the Arabic Verses, 36-40.
 
Old 06-05-2018, 07:04 AM   #69
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
36. O SON OF MAN!
Rejoice in the gladness of thine heart, that thou mayest be worthy to meet Me and to mirror forth My beauty.
(Baha'u'llah, The Arabic Hidden Words)

Whenever we're glad, we should rejoice and increase our happiness. This will get us closer to God.
 
Old 06-06-2018, 06:45 AM   #70
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
37. O SON OF MAN!
Divest not thyself of My beauteous robe, and forfeit not thy portion from My wondrous fountain, lest thou shouldst thirst for evermore.
(Baha'u'llah, The Arabic Hidden Words)

I interpret the beauteous robe to be the good character of a person and also the religion of God. The fountain is the Holy Spirit.
 
Old 06-07-2018, 10:16 AM   #71
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
38. O SON OF BEING!
Walk in My statutes for love of Me and deny thyself that which thou desirest if thou seekest My pleasure.
(Baha'u'llah, The Arabic Hidden Words)

The latter part of the quote has implications. Ideally we would be happy to obey Baha'u'llah's statutes, but if we still desire what is beyond His statutes and counsels we should still not do it. We shouldn't wait until we don't desire it.

Last edited by Duane; 06-07-2018 at 10:21 AM.
 
Old 06-08-2018, 05:40 AM   #72
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Verse 36

I like the imagery of the mirror, reflecting the light of God.

Verse 37

This reminds me of a sermon I listened to over the weekend from a Christian occultist. He talked about the human soul being "the golden wedding garment", ie: what we wear for our reunion with God. The phrase "My beauteous robe" reminds me of that other phrase "the golden wedding garment".

Verse 38

Another verse on the importance of detachment from our own selfish wants.

Verse 39

Here we are enjoined to remember and follow God's laws.

Verse 40

I take this one to mean that the only way to find rest and end suffering is detachment from all save God.
 
Old 06-08-2018, 10:52 AM   #73
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
39. O SON OF MAN! Neglect not My commandments if thou lovest My beauty, and forget not My counsels if thou wouldst attain My good pleasure.

What does this first part mean? Does it mean we will experience more of God's beauty if we follow His commandments? Also what does it mean to attain God's good pleasure? Will we feel pleasure then that comes from God?
 
Old 06-11-2018, 05:23 AM   #74
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Week 9
6/11/2018-6/17/2018
Núr 7/175-Núr 13/175

This week is the Arabic Verses, 41-45.
 
Old 06-11-2018, 09:49 AM   #75
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
41. O SON OF MAN!
Magnify My cause that I may reveal unto thee the mysteries of My greatness and shine upon thee with the light of eternity.
(Baha'u'llah, The Arabic Hidden Words)

This says that we need to teach the faith to get greater illumination.
 
Old 06-11-2018, 04:45 PM   #76
Junior Member
 
Joined: May 2018
From: US
Posts: 14
Would teaching the faith be through our actions and character or through participating in Deepnings like this one, or both or is it referring to something else all together?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
 
Old 06-12-2018, 09:42 AM   #77
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by raf1467rh View Post
Would teaching the faith be through our actions and character or through participating in Deepnings like this one, or both or is it referring to something else all together?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
When I said teach the faith I was thinking about talking to non-Baha'is, but we could also magnify the cause through deepenings and teach the faith through our actions.
 
Old 06-12-2018, 09:51 AM   #78
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jul 2017
From: Kettering, Ohio USA
Posts: 203
42. O SON OF MAN!
Humble thyself before Me, that I may graciously visit thee. Arise for the triumph of My cause, that while yet on earth thou mayest obtain the victory.
(Baha'u'llah, The Arabic Hidden Words)

The victory that Baha'u'llah is talking about here could be the victory over ourselves.
 
Old 06-13-2018, 10:29 AM   #79
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Quote:
Originally Posted by raf1467rh View Post
Would teaching the faith be through our actions and character or through participating in Deepnings like this one, or both or is it referring to something else all together?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
Probably both as well as other things. There's a whole wide variety of things that can work for instructing people.
 
Old 06-13-2018, 10:47 AM   #80
Senior Member
 
Walrus's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2014
From: Wisconsin
Posts: 947
Verse 41

I could see this verse being about teaching, as Duane says, but I could also think of other things one could do that would "Magnify [God's] cause" without necessarily being teaching.

It also reminds me of a phrase that I heard during a dream, which was "In this state [unity] a prayer for the individual becomes a prayer for the whole and a prayer for the whole becomes a prayer for the individual."

This verse seems to be saying something similar, that by helping the whole cause of God we in turn help ourselves in our own individual spiritual advancement.

Verse 42

"Arise for the triumph of My cause, that while yet on earth thou mayest obtain the victory." seems to hint at the fact we can attain the state of Heaven while still living on this earth.

Verse 43

Here we have the idea that remembering God on earth can bring solace to us, easing our hardships.

I am reminded of this quote from Baha'u'llah: "If you fall into trouble, say, “Yá Bahá’u’l-Abhá!” If any one oppose you, say, “Yá Bahá’u’l-Abhá!” Even while at your work, mention “Yá Bahá’u’l-Abhá!”"

Verse 44

This seems to be a follow-up to the previous verse of "thus shall Mine eyes and thine be solaced" with "Thy sight is My sight". Thus solace is brought to both our eyes and God's because our eyes and God's are one and the same.

And then this is interesting to contemplate: "do thou see therewith, that in thine inmost soul thou mayest testify unto My exalted sanctity, and I within Myself may bear witness unto an exalted station for thee."

Us acknowledging God's exalted station is perhaps the same as God acknowledging our own exalted station. Our station, and that of God's station, are interwoven into an exalted relationship.

Verse 45

On the topic of martyrdom mentioned here, I was thinking recently about martyrdom. I came to the conclusion that true martyrdom (not necessarily the acts of those martyrs who die expecting reward, however) is a praiseworthy thing because it is, in a sense, something that can only be done by one who is completely and totally detached from all save God.

Because in accepting death as a martyr, one is truly detaching from and offering up everything earthly. It is the pinnacle of detachment.

Thus to "Seek a martyr’s death" as written here might not be an instruction to behave in a suicidal fashion, but rather a command to detach from all save God, so that at any moment one could accept being separated from the material, and die a martyr, "content with My pleasure and thankful for that which I ordain".
 
Reply

  Baha'i Forums > Baha'i Forums > Baha'i Studies > Religion

Tags
deepening, hidden, words



Thread Tools
Display Modes



Facebook @bahaiforums RSS


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright © 2006 - 2018 Bahai Forums. All rights reserved.