Gleanings XXIX

Rasmus · 01-07-2010, 10:13 AM

on page 70 in Gleaning:

"Whoso hath recognized the Day Spring of Divine guidance and entered His holy court hath drawn nigh unto God and attained His Presence, a Presence which is the real Paradise, and of which the loftiest mansions of heaven are but a symbol. Such a man hath attained the knowledge of the station of Him Who is “at the distance of two bows,”Who standeth beyond the Sadratu’l-Muntahá.

How do you understand this, probably a stupid question but it's not 100% clear to me:

"Him Who is at the distance of two bows"

Is that God or Baha'u'llah himself?

jwiegley · 01-07-2010, 12:08 PM

The following book excerpt offers an excellent discussion on the meaning of this metaphor:

Key concepts in the practice of ... - Google Books

I believe it refers to the Ancient Being, of whom the person of Bahá’u’lláh is a worldly Manifestation. This Being is the reason for creation's existence. If the Sadratu'l-Muntaha exists in the form of a Person, He is the Spirit animating that Person and is the revelation of God's own Being.

But in the spirit of the passage, and in the language of the Divine Unity, I would have to say yes, He is referring to God here, and yes, He is referring to Bahá’u’lláh here. Humans can know nothing higher, and so for us if Bahá’u’lláh were to declare He was God Himself, He "speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto" (Gleanings p.54).

lukasali · 01-12-2010, 12:03 AM

What is the meaning of "at the distance of two bows?" Does anyone know where that description comes from?

jwiegley · 01-12-2010, 01:37 AM

It refers to the "arc of ascent and descent", which if drawn figuratively looks like two bows next each other. This arc is the descent in the physical world, and the subsequent return to the divine world. The Sufis and the Bab wrote about this in many different places, and have names for each of the 7 stages in both arcs.

Rasmus · 01-14-2010, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoyalFalcon

In Bahá'í terminology it refers to the Manifestation of God.

So if this passage was to talk about the station of Bahá'u'lláh (exclusively) that would put him above the other messengers, as it says: beyond the Sadrat'ul-Muntaha.
There are also parts in the Book of Certitude where Him Whom God shall make manifest is given a higher station than previous manifestations and, The Báb also made this quite clear.

The reason I started thinking about this was that someone (a non-baha'i) had made this interpretations and an other interpretation from it - that God and Baha'u'llah are in essence one and the same. Of course I pointed out that there are many scriptures explaining the Divine Unity and logic itself would invalidate this interpretation.
Thus I felt it was important to fully understand this passage.
So often people are misled by a single statement, forgetting everything else that has been written.

jwiegley · 01-14-2010, 12:46 PM

However, we cannot confuse Their station in regard to humanity, with Their Being in regard to Themselves:

Quote:

O Son of Beauty! By My spirit and by My favor! By My mercy and by My beauty! All that I have revealed unto thee with the tongue of power, and have written for thee with the pen of might, hath been in accordance with thy capacity and understanding, not with My state and the melody of My voice.

(Hidden Words, pp.19-20)

In the station of Divine Unity, no distinction can be made between His Messengers. The Sun at dawn may be weaker in radiance than the Sun at noon, and even bear Light of different color, but they are the identical Sun:

Quote:

In this station, were He Who is the embodiment of the End to say: "Verily, I am the Point of the Beginning", He would indeed be speaking the truth. And were He to say: "I am other than Him", this would be equally true. Likewise, were He to proclaim: "Verily, I am the Lord of heaven and earth", or "the King of kings", or "the Lord of the realm above", or Muhammad, or 'Alí, or their descendants, or aught else, He would indeed be proclaiming the truth of God. He, verily, ruleth over all created things and standeth supreme above all besides Him. Hast thou not heard what hath been said aforetime: "Muhammad is our first, Muhammad our last, Muhammad our all"? And elsewhere: "They all proceed from the same Light"?

(Gems, pp.30-31)

Quote:

Know then that, inasmuch as all the Prophets are but one and the same soul, spirit, name, and attribute, thou must likewise see them all as bearing the name Muhammad and as being the son of Hasan, as having appeared from the Jábulqá of God's power and from the Jábulsá of His mercy. For by Jábulqá is meant none other than the treasure-houses of eternity in the all-highest heaven and the cities of the unseen in the supernal realm. We bear witness that Muhammad, the son of Hasan, was indeed in Jábulqá and appeared therefrom. Likewise, He Whom God shall make manifest abideth in that city until such time as God will have established Him upon the seat of His sovereignty.

(Gems, p.37)

01-07-2010, 10:13 AM	#1
Rasmus Junior Member Joined: Jan 2010 From: Sweden Posts: 4	Gleanings XXIX on page 70 in Gleaning: "Whoso hath recognized the Day Spring of Divine guidance and entered His holy court hath drawn nigh unto God and attained His Presence, a Presence which is the real Paradise, and of which the loftiest mansions of heaven are but a symbol. Such a man hath attained the knowledge of the station of Him Who is “at the distance of two bows,”Who standeth beyond the Sadratu’l-Muntahá. How do you understand this, probably a stupid question but it's not 100% clear to me: "Him Who is at the distance of two bows" Is that God or Baha'u'llah himself?

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01-07-2010, 12:08 PM	#2
jwiegley Member Joined: Sep 2009 From: New Jersey, USA Posts: 31	The following book excerpt offers an excellent discussion on the meaning of this metaphor: Key concepts in the practice of ... - Google Books I believe it refers to the Ancient Being, of whom the person of Bahá’u’lláh is a worldly Manifestation. This Being is the reason for creation's existence. If the Sadratu'l-Muntaha exists in the form of a Person, He is the Spirit animating that Person and is the revelation of God's own Being. But in the spirit of the passage, and in the language of the Divine Unity, I would have to say yes, He is referring to God here, and yes, He is referring to Bahá’u’lláh here. Humans can know nothing higher, and so for us if Bahá’u’lláh were to declare He was God Himself, He "speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto" (Gleanings p.54).

01-12-2010, 12:03 AM	#3
lukasali Member Joined: Jan 2010 From: USA Posts: 30	What is the meaning of "at the distance of two bows?" Does anyone know where that description comes from?

01-12-2010, 01:37 AM	#4
jwiegley Member Joined: Sep 2009 From: New Jersey, USA Posts: 31	It refers to the "arc of ascent and descent", which if drawn figuratively looks like two bows next each other. This arc is the descent in the physical world, and the subsequent return to the divine world. The Sufis and the Bab wrote about this in many different places, and have names for each of the 7 stages in both arcs.