LarryK32

As I've said, I'm 16 so I try to convince myself this is some sort of phase but I don't believe it is.

I dream about love. Not sex but love. I realize there are other things I should concentrate on but it's hard when these romantic illusions just fill my mind. I haven't found anyone that I'm compatible with. It's just the idea of finding her.

I'm requesting some Baha'i quotes that could help me cope for now. It's very difficult right now.

And please, NO arguing in this thread, as this is a very sensitive topic with me. :'(

Boethiah

I know very much how you feel. I am also 16 and think much of love. We are sixteen though and we cannot be sure of love. Or, that is what I have come to believe. Youth and inexperience can cloud judgement, but true love will be felt.

I've found that the best way to meet someone new is to not try so hard. If you are looking for love, don't try so hard. You are only 16 years old! You have years and years ahead of you. Just live life, have fun, and be yourself. Things are more likely to turn out this way then going on a hunt for a woman.

Clex19

Larry,

I am your age too and I think I know what you mean. One of my favorite quotes from Baha'u'llah is this:

After I recite this quote to myself, I tell myself that no matter what happens in this life, the next life will be better. It helps me feel content with what I have because I'm promised and guaranteed happiness in the next life.

Here is another quote by Baha'u'llah that I like:

This one also helps me endure difficult times for me. It reminds me that if something good happens, I shouldn't be obsessed with it and stop concentrating on priorities; if something bad happens, I shouldn't be depressed about, because whatever it is, it will pass away sooner or later.

For me, what works best if I have a rough day at school or something, I say my 95 'Allah'u'abha's, an Obligatory Prayer, at least one prayer for detachment, at least one prayer for difficulties, and a prayer for giving thanks to God. After doing that, I feel calm and detached; sanctified from distracting thoughts.

Regarding romantic illusions, Baha'u'llah prohibits having fantasies and that in Lights of Guidance it is said that Baha'i youth must be taught self-control. However, remember that no one is perfect (at least no one alive now) and that we just have to do our best. The rest is up to God. In Some Answered Questions, 'Abdu'l-Baha explains that distracting thoughts are bound to come, but we just have to ignore them the best we can.

All in all, keep your faith in God, pray, and don't be too hard on yourself. If things don't turn out the way you want them to, don't despair. And remember: you're not the only one.

arthra

CLII.

Thine eye is My trust, suffer not the dust of vain desires to becloud its luster. Thine ear is a sign of My bounty, let not the tumult of unseemly motives turn it away from My Word that encompasseth all creation. Thine heart is My treasury, allow not the treacherous hand of self to rob thee of the pearls which I have treasured therein. Thine hand is a symbol of My loving-kindness, hinder it not from holding fast unto My guarded and hidden Tablets.... Unasked, I have showered upon thee My grace. Unpetitioned, I have fulfilled thy wish. In spite of thy undeserving, I have singled thee out for My richest, My incalculable favors....

O My servants! Be as resigned and submissive as the earth, that from the soil of your being there may blossom the fragrant, the holy and multicolored hyacinths of My knowledge. Be ablaze as the fire, that ye may burn away the veils of heedlessness and set aglow, through the quickening energies of the love of God, the chilled and wayward heart. Be light and untrammeled as the breeze, that ye may obtain admittance into the precincts of My court, My inviolable Sanctuary.

~ Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 322-323






O Lord, O Lord, render us successful through Thy conquering power, in that which Thou lovest and approvest, so that we may become standards of guidance, signs of Thy Kingdom, the El-ABHA [and that we may] adore Thee, supplicate before the Kingdom of Thy mercy, beseech Thy realm of might, be submissive to Thy servants, humble before Thy maid-servants, severed from aught else save Thee, sincerely turned unto Thy face, aflame with the fire of Thy love, diffusing thy fragrances, united in Thy Cause, of one accord in Thy religion, and firm in Thy Covenant.

O God, strengthen us through the fragrances of Thy sanctity, that we may become sanctified from the stain of egotism and lust, baptized with Thy Holy Spirit, with the fire of Thy love and the water of Thy bounty.

Verily, Thou art the Bestower, the Assister, the Confirmer, the Beneficent, the Merciful!



~ Abdu'l-Baha, Tablets of Abdu'l-Baha v1, p. 28

bwb

I think it would help if you clarify what you are asking. I don't see that there is anything wrong or difficult-to-cope-with about having fantasies of finding true love. It seems very normal and healthy.

bwb

I just did a keyword search of Baha'i books in Ocean for the word 'love'. 8889 sentences have the word love in them! Good luck to anyone who tries to make a compilation. So, I'm not sure if that helps you, but...apparently Manifestations of God were also obsessed about the subject of love(I guess). :rolleyes

Pollwr

Hello, Larry K32

I have a longish quotation for you. I am considerably older than 16! but know exactly how it feels to get strung up on romantic love. It is a very powerful emotion. I think our western society really hypes it as so important. It is good in a marriage, so long as you have the staying power to weather the times when you don't feel it because in my experience it comes and goes a bit.

Anyway, here is a quotation I like about love:

"In the world of existence there is indeed no greater power than the power of love. When the heart of man is aglow with the flame of love, he is ready to sacrifice all -- even his life. In the Gospel it is said God is love.

There are four kinds of love. The first is the love that flows from God to man; it consists of the inexhaustible graces, the Divine effulgence and heavenly illumination. Through this love the world of being receives life. Through this love man is endowed with physical existence, until, through the breath of the Holy Spirit -- this same love -- he receives eternal life and becomes the image of the Living God. This love is the origin of all the love in the world of creation.

The second is the love that flows from man to God. This is faith, attraction to the Divine, enkindlement, progress, entrance into the Kingdom of God, receiving the Bounties of God, illumination with the lights of the Kingdom. This love is the origin of all philanthropy; this love causes the hearts of men to reflect the rays of the Sun of Reality.

The third is the love of God towards the Self or Identity of God. This is the transfiguration of His Beauty, the reflection of Himself in the mirror of His Creation. This is the reality of love, the Ancient Love, the Eternal Love. Through one ray of this Love all other love exists.

The fourth is the love of man for man. The love which exists between the hearts of believers is prompted by the ideal of the unity of spirits. This love is attained through the knowledge of God, so that men see the Divine Love reflected in the heart. Each sees in the other the Beauty of God reflected in the soul, and finding this point of similarity, they are attracted to one another in love. This love will make all men the waves of one sea, this love will make them all the stars of one heaven and the fruits of one tree. This love will bring the realization of true accord, the foundation of real unity.

But the love which sometimes exists between friends is not (true) love, because it is subject to transmutation; this is merely fascination. As the breeze blows, the slender trees yield. If the wind is in the East the tree leans to the West, and if the wind turns to the West the tree leans to the East. This kind of love is originated by the accidental conditions of life. This is not love, it is merely acquaintanceship; it is subject to change.

Today you will see two souls apparently in close friendship; tomorrow all this may be changed. Yesterday they were ready to die for one another, today they shun one another's society! This is not love; it is the yielding of the hearts to the accidents of life. When that which has caused this 'love' to exist passes, the love passes also; this is not in reality love.

Love is only of the four kinds that I have explained. (a) The love of God towards the identity of God. Christ has said God is Love. (b) The love of God for His children -- for His servants. (c) The love of man for God and (d) the love of man for man. These four kinds of love originate from God. These are rays from the Sun of Reality; these are the Breathings of the Holy Spirit; these are the Signs of the Reality. "

(Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks, p. 179)

I think it is quite normal to be thinking about finding someone at your age. Often you cannot chose how you feel but you have choices in how you act/behave.

Hope you will be happy.

LarryK32

In repliance to those who did not quite understand me, I'm not looking for love right this minute because taking where I live into account I would be incompatible with just about everyone. So it's just the idea of having it with someone. I'm not imagining anyone in particular, just someone.

Yeshua

Hey Larry :wub

I'm 18, so basically the same age group as yourself. I can tell you firstly that what you are experiencing is MORE than natural for somebody your age. Indeed I find it quite admirable. Most young boys your age dream of everything but romance - sex, breasts and well thats the extent of it really :lol. We men can often be very simple creatures when it comes down to our basic instincts. I can certainly attest that when I was about 14 or 15 my thoughts revolved constantly around girls, however unlike you I wasn't always wanting a healthy, romantic, non-sexual relationship. I was on a party bus the other night. We ended up in a nightclub and I can tell you that the majority of young people there had no desire to find 'love' or romance. So many youths today see 'love' as being synonymous with sexual pleasure. Indeed many flit from person to person, with little or no thought for relationships. The act of love has become a merely recreational act, devoid of its spiritual or emotional context. So firstly, I wish too congratulate you for not going with the throng and having the guts to think for yourself.

I think your problem is largely one of 'perception'. You feel that this longing for romantic love is negative, is some kind of thing to be avoided; a hindrance; a distraction; something that is stealing your focus away from other things in your life; a worrying obsession. God is saying, 'No! No! This is how I want you to feel, this is my gift to you!"

The longing for a Beloved is one of the most profound desires known to man. The Book of Proverbs in the Bible accounts, 'the Way of a man with a woman' as one of the four wonders of creation. Our walk with God, our journey to know him and love him and eventually become one with him, is a love story - the greatest Divine Romance in the history of time itself, the most wonderful of love stories. And the good news? You can become the lover in that epic love story right now - by giving your heart up to God and desiring his love more than anything else in the world, more than wine, sex, girls or money! I think that if I were you, I would read the works of Sufi poets like Rumi, Hafez and Saadi and Roman Catholic saints like Teresa of Avila and John of the Cross. Why do I refer you too Islamic and Christian mystics? Because these mystics used the language and concept of sensual, human love as a metaphor for the soul's longing for union with God. All of this fiery emotion you are feeling, all those sleepless nights spent dreaming of your ideal lady, all that feverish day-dreaming that is keeping you off your school work and all the other important things in your life - see it not as some worrying obsession or distraction but as a holy and edifying spiritual call. You are being called by God into the fires of Divine Love. The object of your fancy is a beautiful girl made in the image of the Living God. You desire to have a relationship with her, just as God desires to have a relationship with you. Let this powerful emotion for a humanly love remind you of the far more potent and wondrous desire to be enraptured in the love of God! Human romantic love is the greatest metaphor one could use to approach Divine Love - indeed holy and pure romantic love, is the closest thing on earth to Divine Love. Exult in it my friend!

In the words of Pope Benedict:

An intoxicated and undisciplined eros, then, is not an ascent in “ecstasy” towards the Divine, but a fall, a degradation of man. Evidently, eros needs to be disciplined and purified if it is to provide not just fleeting pleasure, but a certain foretaste of the pinnacle of our existence, of that beatitude for which our whole being yearns. DCE 2



It is neither the spirit alone nor the body alone that loves: it is man, the person, a unified creature composed of body and soul, who loves. Only when both dimensions are truly united, does man attain his full stature. Only thus is love —eros—able to mature and attain its authentic grandeur. DCE 5

Eros, reduced to pure “sex”, has become a commodity, a mere “thing” to be bought and sold, or rather, man himself becomes a commodity. This is hardly man's great “yes” to the body. DCE 5

Love is indeed “ecstasy”, not in the sense of a moment of intoxication, but rather as a journey, an ongoing exodus out of the closed, inward-looking self towards its liberation through self-giving, and thus towards authentic self-discovery and indeed the discovery of God: “Whoever seeks to gain his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life will preserve it” (Lk 17:33), as Jesus says throughout the Gospels (cf. Mt 10:39; 16:25; Mk 8:35; Lk 9:24; Jn 12:25). DCE 6

I am a sucker for Mystical Love poetry that at face value looks profane but which at its heart is sublime with spiritual meaning.

I suggest that you read the biblical book, 'The Song of Songs' here: The Song of songs: a new translation ... - Google Books

This is the best translation around. The Song of Songs was acclaimed by Rabbi Akiva as, 'the Holy of Holies' the greatest book of the Bible. And it isn't about Prophets. There are no priests, no preachers. There is no mention of heaven or hell. There is nothing outwardly 'religious' in it at all. No, it is the simple tale of two young Jewish lovers living in ancient Israel. The Shulamite is a beautiful Nobleman's daugter, who is absolutely besotted with a poor Shepherd Boy from the fields. Unbeknown to their families and despite their class differences, these two conduct a secret love affair. They meet at night and in the day in hidden locations and bask in each others love. In their playful make-believe fantasies the boy is the Shulamite's King Solomon and she his Queen. When they are together they forget about everything else in the entire world. However soon the Shulamite's family find out and they are separated. But she longs to be reunited with her love and endures all kinds of suffering to be with him - even undergoing physical abuse from guards! Evenrtually they are reunited and consummate their love. The continual message of the song is 'not to awaken love until it is ready.' If only more people our age understood this! The love between these two youths is akin to the love between us and God. We are the Shulamite and God is the Beloved Shepherd Boy.

And read this:


A SUFI READING OF SONG OF SONGS


By David Zeidan





introduction
In the Christian world there are many interpretations of the Song of Songs. Some prefer to understand it literally as simply a description of the love relationship between a young man and a young woman, signifying God’s approval of this relationship in all its aspects, including the sexual. This relationship is God’s gift to humanity and is to be celebrated, not ignored or denigrated, so there is no room for prudery in Christianity.

Others see a deeper allegorical meaning in this book: it is an allegory on the relationship between God and Israel (see Jeremiah, 2:2-3; Hosea 2, etc) following OT allusions to Israel as the betrothed of God or the wife of God. Others see it as an allegory of the relationship between Christ and the Church (Eph.5:22-33), or Christ and the individual believer.

I propose that all these interpretations are relevant and valid, and that scripture as God’s inspired word revealed by the intermingling of the divine and the human under the inspiration and control of the Holy Spirit manifests the manifold wisdom of God in manifold ways and interpretations.

It is well known that biblical authors used accepted literary formats of their own times both in Israel and the surrounding nations – covenant documents, proverbs, psalms, eschatology - to communicate the inspired message. I believe Love Songs was one such category which is little known or examined today, and that the Song of Songs was written in this accepted literary format to express a divine message and eternally valid truths. An interesting point is that this form did not die out in the Middle East, but has been used and developed by Islamic Sufi writers and poets over many centuries, using symbols and themes seen in the biblical Song of Songs. We do not know whether there was a direct link back to biblical times, whether there were other similar traditions, maybe among Persian Zoroastrians, and how this form was passed on until taken over by Sufis.

Christian workers generally do not appreciate the importance of the Sufi way in Muslim societies. One worker who did was Lilias Trotter in North Africa who wrote the Seven Secrets of Wisdom to reach Sufi marabouts in the Maghreb in the early 20th century. It is interesting to note that Sufi love allegory is still part of the teaching curriculum of Shia clerics in Iran, and that Ayatollah Khomeini wrote some allegorical love poems in his younger years. Of course all classical Persian poetry is Sufi poetry, and that is true of several other Muslim languages.

In Sufi literature, the true believer is in exile in this world, yearning to return to his divine origin, the eternal undifferentiated unity with God which was broken at birth when the individual human personality was created as a separate entity. This longing for Unity with God leads to the Way of Pilgrimage, the search for intuitive enlightenment and experiential instances of being reunited with God. The Sufi disciplines of fasting, prayer, poverty are seen as helps to achieving this loss of individual personality (fana’ billah) and attainment of unity with God, even if for a short period of time in this life. Meditation, repetitive recitation, rituals of dhikr and sama‘ are all aids in reaching an ecstatic state where this experience can be attained. Sufis also dwell on the motivation for this search, and Love of God is seen as the main motive and driving force for this quest.

For Sufis, God is the object of love, and a living union with God is the goal of the mystical path. In Sufi allegorical poetry the human lover is seeking for the divine beloved, undergoing many trials and difficulties in order to obtain a glimpse of the divine and experience the ecstasy of abiding in the presence of God and being united with God.


The Main Actors
In Christian interpretations there are various views on the number of actors in this drama. Some stipulate two main male and two female participants. Here we posit one main male character, the divine lover, as well as one main female character, the maiden who loves him, yearns for him and searches for him. This is the traditional common sense interpretation. The divine lover manifests himself in a dual role - he is not only a Shepherd, but also a King (1:7,12; 2:7-11). While the male lover symbolizes Christ, the female beloved stands for the individual believer, the precious soul for whom Christ died, seeking after Christ’s presence in her life and for unity with him.

The maidens, daughters and virgins of Jerusalem (1:3-5; 2:7; 3:5, 5:8, 8:4) are the true loyal believers, friends of the maiden, who yearn for every sign of the Lover and encourage the one granted the divine vision.

The friends (5:1, 8:13) are friends of the lover, other true believers who encourage her along the way. They might be the prophets and the apostles. They are alright, but they will not satisfy her desire – it is him she wants to see, it is him she wants to be with.

“Dark am I yet lovely…” (Ch1:5). The beloved knows she is loved by the divine lover, she is sure of it. She knows she is beautiful in his eyes in spite of her human blemishes. However there are others, her brothers (1:6), who do not understand her love for God, nor her obsessive yearning for him. These are her family members who have no time for spiritual things. They are practical, interested only in material things, in possessions like vineyards, and in profitable work. They punish her for her seemingly foolish waste of time in thinking about her lover, singing of him, looking for him. They force her to work in their vineyards hoping this will drive her thoughts away from him. But all to no avail. She cannot forget him, she yearns for him.

The Watchmen (3:3; 5:7) are the establishment religious leaders who are legalists and externalists. They care only for outward form. They know nothing of the hidden inner spiritual life, and nothing of a loving personal relationship with God. They actually persecute those who are looking for the truth. You can never find the Divine Lover while in the company of the watchmen. You must move beyond them.



.

The themes of love and of union
Love transforms and sublimates all lowly matter it touches into pure gold. In Sufism love is the main theme and Sufism employs three words for love: mahabba, ‘ishq, and ‘uns.

Songs opens with a physical expression of love, a kiss: “Let him kiss me with the kisses of his mouth for your love is more delightful than wine”(1:2). The kiss is a sign of affection, of friendship, of love, of kinship, of belonging. Lovers belong exclusively to one another “My lover is mine and I am his . . .” says the beloved (2:16), indicating the unique sense of belonging that permeates the lovers. The beloved, the true believer, loves Christ to the exclusion of all else. “Take me away with you, let us hurry, let the King bring me into his chambers,” implores the beloved (1:4). It is the deepest desire and yearning of the believer’s heart to be with Christ, united with Him, alone with Him. To be taken away from this world of suffering and alienation to the secret place of God’s dwelling, the inner sanctuary, the holiest of all. In His presence is fullness of joy. This theme of yearning for union with the divine lover is complementary to the theme of love.

Their love is mutual and reciprocal. He is altogether lovely in her eyes, and she is beautiful in his. They while away their time singing of each other’s attractions. That is the proper pastime of real lovers – describing their beloved. Songs has many passages in which the lovers describe each other, dwell on the physical beauty and attractions of the other, using similes from nature to describe their beloved’s hair, eyes, cheeks, teeth, lips, mouth, neck, breasts, arms, legs, feet. They liken these to goats, doves, pomegranates, apple tree, fawns, gazelles, spices, flowers, gold, ivory, water pools, etc. (4:1-7; 5:10-16; 6:4-9; 7:1-9). In Sufi poetry too the language of physical love is often used as the lovers speak of tresses and rosy cheeks, of kisses and union. But every word in this vocabulary is filled with connotations and symbols of divine love. Pure human love should both symbolize the love relationship between a believer and Christ and arouse this love in the hearts of both lovers and onlookers.




The wine theme
The symbolism of intoxication by God’s love is a common Sufi theme In Sufi poetry, the wine house, the innkeeper, the cupbearer who offers the beloved the cup with fiery wine all signify the pre-eminence of love over external rites and outward forms. Wine is a symbol of the divine love which leads to a condition similar to drunkenness, intoxication (sukr) – the human lover is drunk with God’s love which is beyond expression. To be drunk, intoxicated, is to be overcome by God’s presence and love. People who see themselves as sober, ruled only by their intellects, cannot understand the divine intoxication of Love, and often persecute the true lovers of God.

Wine is divine joy and love. True believers are drunk with the wine of the Divine lover’s love. The wine drinker has imbibed the wine of divine love which intoxicates him and releases him from the fetters of legalism and convention. He leaves behind him those who spend all their time obeying the letter of the law but not its spirit. The Innkeeper is the Spiritual Guide who also appears as the Cup-Bearer and the Wine-Seller.

The House of Wine (tavern, inn, pub) is the place where true believers meet to experience together the presence of their divine lover, to drink the wine of his love, to forget all else but Him. There they get drunk on God’s love, leaving sobriety and attaining the ecstatic state of experiencing God’s love in their innermost being. In Sufi literature it is contrasted to the mosque where the legalists meet and which is likened to a cemetery. Legalists know nothing of true love of God while those drunk with the wine of God’s love see God in everything.

In Songs the lover takes his beloved to the house of wine (2:4) where he spreads his banner of love over her. Most English translations have “banquet hall” or “banqueting table” instead of the original “house of wine” (beit hayayin). That may be due to Evangelical fears of alcohol! But in Sufi symbolism the house of wine is the place where true believers gather to share the experience of God’s love symbolized by wine.

Wine is mentioned many times in Songs(1:2-6; 4:10; 7:9) as the central symbol of God’s love and joy. The beloved likens her lover’s love to wine, his love, says the bride, is better than wine, indeed it is better than the best of this-worldly wines, and she offers the wine of her love to him to drink (7:9). The divine lover tells his beloved that her love is much more pleasing than wine (4:10). True believers are drunk, not with wine, but with their experience of God’s love.




The theme of suffering
The believer on his pilgrimage to God is inspired by love but matures through suffering which prepares him for the final annihilation of self before God culminating in unity with God. Suffering is inherent in love. Suffering is the result of the struggle against the lower self, the sinful ‘I’, the flesh. This is a struggle to the death, symbolized by the cross the believer bears as he follows Christ. As Paul said: “I have been crucified with Christ, and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God who loved me and gave himself for me” (Gal 2:20). Once the believer has given up all human concerns and is exclusively devoted to recalling God he will be filled by the divine Lover and experience the presence of God. Suffering for the sake of love is the believer’s lot as he yearns to become a martyr of love, like his Lord: “..love is as strong as death, its jealousy unyielding as the grave” (8:6). Suffering, pain and anguish are necessary in the fight against man’s natural self, the greatest enemy of his quest for God, which must be subdued by a ceaseless inner struggle. The spiritual self seeks for union with God, but is held back by man’s old nature, his egoistic self. The battle is won by Love, the greatest of all weapons. When the spark of Love is fanned into a flame, it burns away everything and purifies the heart. “It burns like a blazing fire, like a mighty flame. Many waters cannot quench love; rivers cannot wash it away” (8:6-7). Having reached this stage, the believer can think of nothing but of the divine Lover, constantly repeating his Name (dhikr), forgetting herself, annihilating self and will in Christ.

In Indian Sufi poetry, the suffering woman is a type of the soul in its development from lower self to the stage of soul at rest in God. The only way to reach union with God is by death, so the beloved longs for suffering, pain, and death to be reborn in her Lover. For that she must empty herself, be completely broken, and surrender totally to Him. This is the way to a new life in him. The true beloved gives up everything, including her own life, for the sake of her lover.

True believers often experience that union is hidden behind separation. Only in the dark night of the soul, when all seems lost, does the “sun of righteousness” arise, and its light is reflected in the mirror of the beloved’s heart. Sufis teach that this mirror must be constantly polished to remove the worldly stains by constant remembering of the Lord so it may reflect His perfect beauty without blemish.

In Songs the beloved several times describes herself as “sick (faint, weak0 with love” (2:5) this is the internal emotional suffering of separated lovers longing for a reunion with the beloved. Without their lover, they feel incomplete, a part of them is missing, they are not whole, something has been cut off. When the lover appears the sickness is over, the suffering ends in the bliss of union and wholeness. Several times in Songs the beloved suffers because of this separation (3:1-3; 5:2-7), as she gets up to search for her lover. The quest is tiresome and she gets beaten. It was her fault because she fell asleep (her flesh, her lower soul, led her astray) and she has to struggle against her old “I” so she can be reunited with her lover.

Her heart constantly worries: Where is he? When will he reveal himself? How can she find him? These thoughts are always uppermost in her mind. “Tell me whom I love, where you graze the flock, and where you rest your sheep at midday, for why should I be like a veiled woman beside the flocks of your friends” (ch1:7). The divine lover answers her, assuring her that she is beautiful in his eyes, telling her where to meet him – by the tents of the shepherds. He is not found in the King’s palace, nor in the Temple, but in the places where his humble followers (the sheep) feed under the care of their God-loving leaders (the shepherds). Look for them and you will find him. Don’t make the mistake of looking for the legalists or the ritualists. Don’t look in the wrong place where the proud and mighty dwell – he is not there.

“I slept yet my heart was awake” (5:2) – true believers have withdrawn themselves from all that is other than God. Although seemingly awake, they are in reality asleep to the affairs of this world. They are awake only to the divine Lover, God, His call, his presence.

Another interpretation is that the beloved lost her lover because she fell asleep. This is the sleep of heedlessness, a major sin for Sufis. She runs after him in despair, seeking for a glimpse of him somewhere, meeting discouragement and suffering along the way. His final reappearance signifies that she has found him within her – he lives in her.

This tension between the condition in which the divine lover seems far away and the times when he seems to draw near symbolize also the various emotional and spiritual states and stages along the pilgrim’s path to God.




The nature-garden theme
The beauties of nature, especially as seen in gardens, orchards, flowers and birds, are all reflections of God’s divine beauties. Gardens offer a glimpse of paradise, the original garden, the true abode of the real believer and lover of God, and those who love God feel here on earth the bliss of paradise.

The beauties of nature serve as signposts along the path to God, symbols of His eternal perfections. Gardens and nature also offer glimpses of the enchanted inner world of the spirit and of the quest for Love. Those who are too busy with self and material things do not notice their beauty nor hear their voice as all nature praises the creator, “The heavens declare the glory of God…” (Ps 19:1). The ignorant majority turn their backs on this manifestation of God, giving in to pressures of time, work, family, and responsibilities.

In Sufi poetry the believer’s heart is a garden whose fruits are God’s attributes, in biblical terms he is being transformed in the image of Christ, bearing the fruit of the Spirit. Wafting through the garden is the breeze of intimacy with God. In arid areas trees and flowers are refreshing and reviving, a place of pleasure and rest. Trees also symbolize the true believers who thrive on the water of life hidden beneath the desert surface, nourished by hidden streams of God’s love, refreshed by the breeze of God’s love. Fruit trees symbolize their fruitfulness in God’s service.

Songs abounds in descriptions of gardens, orchards, trees and flowers (2:1-13; 4:12-16; 6:11-12; 8:5,13). The beloved likens herself to a rose and a lily (2:1) and her lover to an apple tree that provides both fruit and shade (2:3), nurture and protection. “I am a rose of Sharon a lily of the valleys” (Ch2:1). The rose (gul) and the rose garden (gulistan) are an important theme in Persian Sufi poetry where the rose symbolizes the soul of the believer which God longs to possess. The rose is protected from its enemies by thorns. The breeze blowing on the rose-bud removes its veil – the bud unfolds gradually and comes into flower. So the divine Lover reveals himself gradually to the hungry yearning soul.

The lover likens his beloved to an enclosed garden (4:12) which has walls and a gate. This is the believer’s soul, protected from the world and kept exclusively for Christ’s pleasure – “I have come into my garden, my sister, my bride.” (5:1). This is where the divine lover enjoys the offerings of the believer’s love and devotion (6:2). In Sufi symbolism the walled garden often denotes the world of the spirit and of love in contrast to the material world. The gate (Christ) is the only entrance to this world. By God’s grace this gate is opened, and the pilgrim forgets all the vain things of this world and enters a far greater and more beautiful world of God’s love and grace.

Descriptions of the arrival of spring (2:11-13; 7:11-13) would in Sufi symbolism speak of the resurrection, as well as of the new life in unity following the death of the old nature. Winter symbolises the crucifixion of self, as only following it can true love be given and received (“there will I give you my love” 7:12), true unity experienced.

Perfume, spices, herbs, fragrance, scent
Perfumes and fragrance are often used Sufi symbols mentioned in Songs (1:3,12-14; 3:6; 4:6,10-13; 5:1). They denote the intimations of the Lover’s approach, they are signs of his nearness – he must be near for I can smell his fragrance in the air. It is a taste (dhawk) of better things to come, of the real thing – the Lover himself. The fragrance and scent of costly herbs and spices make the absent lover present and give information about him. These initial signs are powerful enough to cause the virgins, the bride’s companions who also adore the bridegroom, to love him (Ch1:3).

Fragrance also speaks of the human willingness to please God in everything, offering him all we have and are.

The Song of Songs Larry, was the spiritual love story and metaphor that sparked of the Christian Mystic and Islamic Sufi traditions. It IS the epic of all time. It is sacred, profane, spiritual, romantic, erotic and Divine all at once. It has so many layers of meaning!

Now here is the Dark Night of the Soul by St John of the Cross (one of the greatest Spanish Catholic saints), sung by Loreena McKennit. In it John uses his human love as a metaphor for his soul's longing in the darkness of his sin and despair to become reunited with God. This song is about being transformed by the holy spirit. The Dark Night of the Soul (from which the spiritual term takes its name) narrates the journey of the soul from her bodily home to her union with God. It happens during the night, which represents the hardships and difficulties she meets in detachment from the world and reaching the light of the union with the Creator. There are several steps in this night, which are related in successive stanzas. The main idea of the poem can be seen as the painful experience that people endure as they seek to grow in spiritual maturity and union with God. The beloved one is God, not a woman, although on face value it appears to be a man. The soul, whether in a male or female, is always imaged as "female" who is the "Lover" in a non-physical way of God, who is always depicted as the bridegroom. All creation is a wedding. We are the Bride, God is the Bridegroom. The marriage ceremony is the union of our souls with God. Listen to the words, read the words and learn from them:

Clex19

I'd be surprised if the majority of people where you live are really incompatible with you, but you know more about that than I do. The idea of being romatically in love with someone is completely normal, so you don't need to worry about that.

Here's another short quote, but it's not about love:

Yeshua

Here are the lyrics of the song's condensed version of the poem (which is MUCH longer). I feel you are going through a kind of 'Dark Night of the Soul' as described below and above in that article. There is more to your longing than mere sensual romance. Of that I am convinced. Your sensual desires are merely the top layer of a much deeper longing in the darkness of your soul (I suggest you play the song while reading the lyrics, it will help it reach your soul):

Upon a darkened night
the flame of love was burning in my breast
And by a lantern bright
I fled my house while all in quiet rest

Shrouded by the night
and by the secret stair I quickly fled
The veil concealed my eyes
while all within lay quiet as the dead


Chorus
Oh night thou was my guide
oh night more loving than the rising sun
Oh night that joined the lover
to the beloved one
transforming each of them into the other


Upon that misty night
in secrecy, beyond such mortal sight
Without a guide or light
than that which burned so deeply in my heart


That fire t'was led me on
and shone more bright than of the midday sun
To where he waited still
it was a place where no one else could come


Chorus


Within my pounding heart
which kept itself entirely for him
He fell into his sleep
beneath the cedars all my love I gave
And by the fortress walls
the wind would brush his hair against his brow
And with its smoothest hand
caressed my every sense it would allow


Chorus


I lost myself to him
and laid my face upon my lovers breast
And care and grief grew dim
as in the mornings mist became the light
There they dimmed amongst the lilies fair
There they dimmed amongst the lilies fair
There they dimmed amongst the lilies fair

Yeshua

Pollwr that quote from Abdul Baha is so touchingly beautiful. I love it!! What a wonderfully insightful and spiritual man Abdul Baha was. His face is so handsome in youth and so kind, grandfatherly and warm in old age. He was a pure soul.

Yeshua

I have another quote for you Larry :wub

"What more do you want, o soul! And what else do you search for outside, when within yourself you possess your riches, delights, satisfaction and kingdom -- your beloved whom you desire and seek? Desire him there, adore him there. Do not go in pursuit of him outside yourself. You will only become distracted and you won't find him, or enjoy him more than by seeking him within you." -- Saint John of the Cross

Maybe this is where your desire will ultimately lead, not necessarily towards an outside Beloved (a girl, although I assure there will be plenty of them with a wandering eye on you :wink You just have to look harder!) but the Beloved within.

What have I got with John of the Cross tonight lol? I think you talking about girls - 'Beloveds' - has oddly enough re-ignited my passion for him.

If you attend clubs and go for nights out etc. you will meet lots of girls. Just trust in God, he will not let anything good pass you by. A good quote to remember: “If you greatly desire something, have the guts to stake everything on obtaining it.”
Brendan Francis quotes

cire perdue

I'm older and in preparing for moving I found many pictures of me around your age, and it is so painful to remember how unloved I felt and how desperate I was for love. It took too many years to learn that there was a hole in me that could only be filled by God. I even had to learn what personal faith was, to be able to believe I would be okay. I had to learn to love me, to have compassion for me. Being a Baha'i helped immensely, but it was almost like I needed catch up work to really be able to grasp how the Faith worked in my life. I'm only happy with my recent years. I did find people to talk to who offered guidance. I still think one has to love one's self first. One learns to love by being loved. Parents may not always do that adequately and if that happens then one has to do it themselves. We certainly live in times where parents can not be connected to their children, though they may love them. This world moves awfully fast and you can't rewind to get what was missed. One does not have to be crazy, but only unhappy to seek help. In fact if one is sincerely unhappy, it is crazy not to seek help.....

LarryK32

I know I am loved by my family, my friends. But I'm a bit paranoid. My parents have lied to me my whole life. Mostly little stuff to surprise me (I've always hated surprises and they know that) but after a while it adds up. I'm paranoid of not finding a girl and if I do she'll be unfaithful (my bestfriend's gf cheated on him :'( ). I'm terrified because thats really all I want in this life.

Yeshua

Listen mate. Now listen good! :wub You are only SIXTEEN!!! :tongue enough said! :lol Just enjoy your youth and when the time is right you will meet somebody. Patience is a virtue. Also I wouldn't worry about 'infidelity' before you've even entered a relationship. You are a sensible type of guy, I can tell that, so I know you wouldn't go for the 'loose' type (I chose the most tame word I could :unsure). But even if you did it isn't the end of the world. We've all been cheated upon or dumped at some point in our lives. It sucks but you get over it - all one big learning curve. All you do is wait for somebody else and again and again and again, until you meet the right lady - and that could be in fifty years time, twenty-five years time, two years time, a month, a week or tomrrow. There is no hard and fast rule when it comes to love, no secret art like kama sutra, no magical formulae. My advice to you is stop worrying about 'love'. You need to think about 'studies', 'socializing' and 'fun' as well. The quest for love is not the only thing in your life, even if you regard it as such. I will say a few little prayers on your behalf :wub

LarryK32

Thank you, Yeshua. Everything you have said has been very touching. :')

I try to study and socialize but I have few friends and I'm not well-liked by my peers as I used to be that guy who was always chosen last and picked on. I can honestly say I didn't have a friend until 7th grade. It's just that my friends and studies don't make me content. I'm not depressed but I don't think I can say I'm happy either. I long for someone to hold and it is becoming increasingly difficult to overcome these fantasies of love.

Yeshua

Hey Larry :wub

I didn't have a lot of friends when I was at school either. I just had a very small group. We (about five of us) where never in with the 'in crowd'. Thats completely normal. You don't need 'lots of friends' to be happy - just one or two close ones you can confide in from time to time. Believe or not, those people with LOADS of friends are often very lonely. They always want to be the centre of attention because they have deep seated insecurities, so they flit from group to group trying to be everybody's friend. In the end, they make no real friendships - its all pretence. The 'in crowd' at my school - want a laugh? More than half of them never met each other again, THAT is the extent of their friendship, whereas I still see two of my friends :wub (even though we are separated by a long, long distance now at our respective unis, we keep very much in touch). When you get to Uni, you will also make more friends. So no probs there :wub I think you are suffering from a low self esteem. And its crazy. Your talented, intelligent, caring, kind-hearted and hopelessly romantic (what a girl would call 'sweet' or 'cute') - what girl wouldn't want you? In fact I bet you've had looks that you don't know about. Seriously your worrying needlessly. And as concerns love, the Song of Songs from the Bible says, 'Do not awaken love until it is ready". The right moment will come, so long as you wait patiently and don't try to force it. The problem noawadays is that too many people your age are giving into peer-pressure and the fantasy from cheesy teen movies and 'awakening love' LONG before they are ready. Just wait for it and enjoy it when it comes but don't obsess over it. As I said read the song of songs translation I quoted above :wink Good luck my friend! And buck up :wink You have a lot to be thankful for!

bwb

One thing that religious faith gives you is a great expansion in the types of love that it is possible to experience. True love isn't the garbage that you see on television mostly. True love is self-sacrificing love. If you heroically sacrifice yourself for someone else, for example, even if you never meet that person in this life, it will still be the foundation for true and everlasting love or eternal friendship with that person when you meet him/her after death. And you can cultivate and treasure true love with people who have sacrificed themselves for you, even though they may have lived before you were even born, such as love for the Bab, Baha'u'llah, 'Abdu'l-Baha and the other Divine Manifestations.


"The Ancient Beauty hath consented to be bound with chains that mankind may be released from its bondage, and hath accepted to be made a prisoner within this most mighty Stronghold that the whole world may attain unto true liberty. He hath drained to its dregs the cup of sorrow, that all the peoples of the earth may attain unto abiding joy, and be filled with gladness. This is of the mercy of your Lord, the Compassionate, the Most Merciful. We have accepted to be abased, O believers in the Unity of God, that ye may be exalted, and have suffered manifold afflictions, that ye might prosper and flourish. He Who hath come to build anew the whole world, behold, how they that have joined partners with God have forced Him to dwell within the most desolate of cities!"

(Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 99)

bwb

"Consider to what extent the love of God makes itself manifest. Among the signs of His love which appear in the world are the dawning points of His Manifestations. What an infinite degree of love is reflected by the divine Manifestations toward mankind! For the sake of guiding the people They have willingly forfeited Their lives to resuscitate human hearts. They have accepted the cross. To enable human souls to attain the supreme degree of advancement, They have suffered during Their limited years extreme ordeals and difficulties. If Jesus Christ had not possessed love for the world of humanity, surely He would not have welcomed the cross. He was crucified for the love of mankind. Consider the infinite degree of that love. Without love for humanity John the Baptist would not have offered his life. It has been likewise with all the Prophets and Holy Souls. If the Báb had not manifested love for mankind, surely He would not have offered His breast for a thousand bullets. If Bahá'u'lláh had not been aflame with love for humanity, He would not have willingly accepted forty years' imprisonment.

Observe how rarely human souls sacrifice their pleasure or comfort for others, how improbable that a man would offer his eye or suffer himself to be dismembered for the benefit of another. Yet all the divine Manifestations suffered, offered Their lives and blood, sacrificed Their existence, comfort and all They possessed for the sake of mankind. Therefore, consider how much They love. Were it not for Their love for humanity, spiritual love would be mere nomenclature. Were it not for Their illumination, human souls would not be radiant. How effective is Their love! This is a sign of the love of God, a ray of the Sun of Reality."

(Abdu'l-Baha, The Promulgation of Universal Peace, p. 256)

"Give ear to the sayings of the Friend and turn towards His paradise. Worldly friends, seeking their own good, appear to love one the other, whereas the true Friend hath loved and doth love you for your own sakes; indeed He hath suffered for your guidance countless afflictions. Be not disloyal to such a Friend, nay rather hasten unto Him. Such is the daystar of the word of truth and faithfulness, that hath dawned above the horizon of the pen of the Lord of all names. Open your ears that ye may hearken unto the word of God, the Help in peril, the Self-existent."

(Baha'u'llah, The Persian Hidden Words)

LarryK32

Thank you for your kind words but I'm not talented and have gotten no 'looks' from anyone. That I know for sure. I suffer from much more insecurities than the 'in-crowd' as you can see from my self-esteem, trust issues and paranoia. And I don't see how I've tried to force it. I haven't asked anyone out or looked at any girl as a potential girlfriend. Mostly because I think she'll cheat on me.

bwb

In the process of trying to research something for you to post in this thread, I stumbled across this web site. Maybe there is something in it for you, even if it is a little different from the type of answer that you were looking for:

Baha’i Heroes & Heroines

bwb

Come on man, the computer revolution has made us nerdly types lords of the universe. Sports jocks can basically kiss our feet now. You obviously have enough talent to use a computer and the internet. Developing computer skills is a good way to have friends. Some of my best socializing experiences have been using my computer skills to rescue people from their computer woes.

When I was a youth and having problems, the Local Spiritual Assembly appointed a couple of Baha'is to meet with me every week or two weeks or something. They were great. It's great the way that the Baha'i community takes care of you in that way.

arthra

Larry

I think what you're going through is not all that unusual and is pretty normal.. fear of being rejected..low self esteem and all the rest.

I'd suggest something like maybe associating with a group of people either in your Baha'i community or at school .. like a common interest group or club.

That way you can get to know people better and they can get to know you and a real trust can develope..:wink

bwb

"12. Know thou of a certainty that Love is the secret of God's holy Dispensation, the manifestation of the All-Merciful, the fountain of spiritual outpourings. Love is heaven's kindly light, the Holy Spirit's eternal breath that vivifieth the human soul. Love is the cause of God's revelation unto man, the vital bond inherent, in accordance with the divine creation, in the realities of things. Love is the one means that ensureth true felicity both in this world and the next. Love is the light that guideth in darkness, the living link that uniteth God with man, that assureth the progress of every illumined soul. Love is the most great law that ruleth this mighty and heavenly cycle, the unique power that bindeth together the divers elements of this material world, the supreme magnetic force that directeth the movements of the spheres in the celestial realms. Love revealeth with unfailing and limitless power the mysteries latent in the universe. Love is the spirit of life unto the adorned body of mankind, the establisher of true civilization in this mortal world, and the shedder of imperishable glory upon every high-aiming race and nation.

Whatsoever people is graciously favoured therewith by God, its name shall surely be magnified and extolled by the Concourse from on high, by the company of angels, and the denizens of the Abha Kingdom. And whatsoever people turneth its heart away from this Divine Love -- the revelation of the Merciful -- shall err grievously, shall fall into despair, and be utterly destroyed. That people shall be denied all refuge, shall become even as the vilest creatures of the earth, victims of degradation and shame.

O ye beloved of the Lord! Strive to become the manifestations of the love of God, the lamps of divine guidance shining amongst the kindreds of the earth with the light of love and concord.

All hail to the revealers of this glorious light!"

(Abdu'l-Baha, Selections from the Writings of Abdu'l-Baha, p. 27)

bwb

Whatever one's goal is, success usually depends on perseverance in overcoming obstacles. I hope that this short compilation of Baha'i quotations that I made is helpful:
http://bahaiforums.com/blogs/bwb/51-...uotations.html

"Everything of importance in this world demands the close attention of its seeker. The one in pursuit of anything must undergo difficulties and hardships until the object in view is attained and the great success is obtained. This is the case of things pertaining to the world. How much higher is that which concerns the Supreme Concourse! That Cause involves every favor, glory and eternal bliss in the world of God. The seeker after the great guidance and eternal happiness necessarily will encounter difficulties. He must be patient under such circumstances. The chosen believers of the past quaffed the chalice of suffering and sank deep in the ocean of trials until they attained to that blessed station and sublime beatitude."

(Abdu'l-Baha, Tablets of Abdu'l-Baha v2, p. 265)

LarryK32

In order to socialize with other Baha'is I'm going to have to wait until I go to college because I live no where close to any Baha'is. And there really aren't clubs at my school that aren't full of the type of people that would pick on me. And I'm not all that great with a computer. :\

bwb

"A tree can live solitary and alone, but this is impossible for man without retrogression."

(Abdu'l-Baha, The Promulgation of Universal Peace, p. 337)

BruceDLimber

Larry, Yeshua, and BWB, I wish you all well on your quests! :-)

And if any of you are feeling ambitious, while this is a great forum, please permit me to recommend another one as well:

The discussion area at Planet Baha'i, which you can find at:

www.planetbahai.org

is a truly wonderful one, and has a great mix of both Baha'is and others participating there!

Good stuff. :-)

Bruce

bwb

Thankyou for the suggestion. As far as I could tell, there is no way to access the planetbahai forums without lowering my web browser security level, which is why I've stayed away. There doesn't seem to be any way that I could even have a preview look at the forum without first registering. If you learn of any solution to these issues, please tell me.

Yeshua

Thank you Bruce I will defo check out PlanetBahai

LarryK32

I tried PlanetBaha'i before this but the software was very confusing. I guess I'll try again. :/

BruceDLimber

BWB, I don't know about the security levels and website access, but I encourage you to lower your levels temporarily at least to check out and possibly try the discussion forum!

And Larry, be sure you select the "Discussion" forum when you get on there: there are a number of other areas available there, too; but they're things you can check out later if you like.

Regards, :-)

Bruce

cire perdue

I feel in love at age 15 with a girl from church who was a year older. In those days one did not have sex, but I was bonded with her. She broke up with me later in the year and then we were on and off again the next year. She actually treated me rather shabbily considering how I cared about her. We parted ways finally when she left for college. THen 30 years later she called me having been just divorced. We got together again, but with me using Baha'i guidance for relationships. Within about 8 months things quit working. I had been in a pink cloud of happiness, and it just evaporated. Her parents were against us marrying. I broke up with her, and even handled it very badly. That was 10 years ago, and now I know that being bonded to someone at age 15 is a terrible thing. We were very different and not really compatible. Yet I "loved" her. If one does fall in love at this young age what can one do about it. It is not usually possible to marry. If one does, what if one changes so much that you have nothing in common. In the future it may be possible to do this at a young age, but western culture has extended adolesence rather than giving responsibilities to its young. Adolesence is painful. One feels defined by one's friends. Friends are a necessity. It feels like it will never get better, but it will. It will take time. Worry and fear do not help, but both ruin the present. It is important not to project into the future saying such and such will happen, and practice stopping fear and worry. FEAR is false events appearing real. Things never happen as we project. How can we think of solutions and options if we are stuck in worry and fear? Practice faith, that despite fear and worry, things will become better. Look for the good in each day. Practice being in a holding pattern rather than worry and fearing. It takes practice to do this!

The Lion

Is there something traditional to offer a woman when you wish to be engaged?

arthra

It could depend on the culture of course.. In my area people have engagement rings.. but it depends. If it's a family heirloom and passed down say such as a ring that belonged to your mother that's traditional. Maybe a Baha'i ring would be suitable:

Baha'i Jewelry,Bahai Faith Jewelry,Bahaullah Greatest Name Ringstone Symbol Ring

The Lion

Can anyone enlighten me?

Yeshua

So true Cire and that is such a tragic, heart-felt story

The Lion

I asked a couple of days back for writings referencing the love between a man and a woman. My reason is that I would like to quote them when I ask for her hand, but wish to quote them directly and correctly and not paraphrase . Thx.

cire perdue

Right off hand I would have to look them up. I would go to the BAHA'I REFERENCE LIBRARY and look up marriage and see if there is something that fits.