rules vs values

cire perdue · 06-02-2011, 09:45 AM

Baha'is do not have rules that pertain to all aspects of behavior. After hearing about Muslim rules on behavior between men and women it occurred to me that rules that are too stringent and don't expect the best of people, but the worst. It may be my naive view but if a woman is responsible for a man's sexual response to her that is essentially erroneous. It would seem also to have been the justificiation for some pretty horrible behavior that occurs in extreme examples, but not uncommon. That obviously criminal activity is justified by the victim's breaking rules would seem to undermine basic legality in a majority of the world's courts. Baha'is believe people are basically good. The increase of loose sexual behavior is not because of the way people dress, but because of the lack of belief in the importance of moral and spiritual values. Women or men should be respected not by how they dress, but because God created them. Having to dress a certain way to protect one's self seems like an outward solution to an inward problem.

I had to go to therapy to learn I am responsible for my feelings and actions no matter what anyone else does. Baha'is believe that mankind is basically good and my own changes and the changes I see other people make confirm this for me. I think America has been successful in showing that men and women can live together without stringent rules and that the equality of women is possible without the fall of civilization. It is difficult to me to consider that more rules about dress and behavior between the sexes like Islam could advance us further as people. We discovered we cannot legislate racial equality in American, but it is coming about because we really are one human race and under the right cirmcumstances which the laws did help provide it become apparent that we are a family. That is a change in values that rules helped!

tonyfish58 · 06-06-2011, 11:24 PM

Yes we now already have far to many rules

This is because society is trying to impart moral and spiritual values by law rather than a belief in a God. IMHO

People believe that they can conduct themselves according to good values without a God in their lives.

The world of today proves this is not possible and will continue imparting new laws to address this.

We have been given the Key - It is Moderation - So lets tackle dress with this guide for today, what is moderate? - Its is not fully veiled and it is not is a large state of undress. We are to choose the moderate line and be mostly covered. Once we practice this, the generations will learn and dress accordingly, we do not have to make it law, it is what we will want to do.

Cheers Tony

Pollwr · 06-07-2011, 02:29 AM

This reminds me of one of the introductory passages in the Kitab-i-aqdads (Book of laws)

"Think not that We have revealed unto you a mere code of laws. Nay, rather, We have unsealed the choice Wine with the fingers of might and power. To this beareth witness that which the Pen of Revelation hath revealed. Meditate upon this, O men of insight!..."

(Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 332)

06-02-2011, 09:45 AM	#1
cire perdue Senior Member Joined: Sep 2010 From: Louisiana Posts: 1,619	rules vs values Baha'is do not have rules that pertain to all aspects of behavior. After hearing about Muslim rules on behavior between men and women it occurred to me that rules that are too stringent and don't expect the best of people, but the worst. It may be my naive view but if a woman is responsible for a man's sexual response to her that is essentially erroneous. It would seem also to have been the justificiation for some pretty horrible behavior that occurs in extreme examples, but not uncommon. That obviously criminal activity is justified by the victim's breaking rules would seem to undermine basic legality in a majority of the world's courts. Baha'is believe people are basically good. The increase of loose sexual behavior is not because of the way people dress, but because of the lack of belief in the importance of moral and spiritual values. Women or men should be respected not by how they dress, but because God created them. Having to dress a certain way to protect one's self seems like an outward solution to an inward problem. I had to go to therapy to learn I am responsible for my feelings and actions no matter what anyone else does. Baha'is believe that mankind is basically good and my own changes and the changes I see other people make confirm this for me. I think America has been successful in showing that men and women can live together without stringent rules and that the equality of women is possible without the fall of civilization. It is difficult to me to consider that more rules about dress and behavior between the sexes like Islam could advance us further as people. We discovered we cannot legislate racial equality in American, but it is coming about because we really are one human race and under the right cirmcumstances which the laws did help provide it become apparent that we are a family. That is a change in values that rules helped!

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06-06-2011, 11:24 PM	#2
tonyfish58 Senior Member Joined: Sep 2010 From: Australia Posts: 828	Yes we now already have far to many rules This is because society is trying to impart moral and spiritual values by law rather than a belief in a God. IMHO People believe that they can conduct themselves according to good values without a God in their lives. The world of today proves this is not possible and will continue imparting new laws to address this. We have been given the Key - It is Moderation - So lets tackle dress with this guide for today, what is moderate? - Its is not fully veiled and it is not is a large state of undress. We are to choose the moderate line and be mostly covered. Once we practice this, the generations will learn and dress accordingly, we do not have to make it law, it is what we will want to do. Cheers Tony

06-07-2011, 02:29 AM	#3
Pollwr Senior Member Joined: Jun 2009 From: earth Posts: 311	This reminds me of one of the introductory passages in the Kitab-i-aqdads (Book of laws) "Think not that We have revealed unto you a mere code of laws. Nay, rather, We have unsealed the choice Wine with the fingers of might and power. To this beareth witness that which the Pen of Revelation hath revealed. Meditate upon this, O men of insight!..." (Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 332)