Have humans always existed?

Jul 2017
511
Olympia, WA, USA
Recently I read somewhere that according to Baha’u’llah, humans existed on other planets before they evolved on earth, and humans have existed as long as God has existed, which is from eternity. I cannot remember where I read this so I could be remembering it incorrectly. Does anyone here know if this is true or if there are any Baha’i quotes that support it?
 

ams

Nov 2019
88
Thailand
Hi @Trailblazer

on What the Baha'i Writings Say About Life On Other Planets i found:

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

The learned men, that have fixed at several thousand years the life of this earth, have failed,
throughout the long period of their observation, to consider either the number or the age of the other planets.

Consider, moreover, the manifold divergencies that have resulted from the theories propounded by these men.

Know thou that every fixed star hath its own planets, and every planet its own creatures, whose number no man can compute.

( Bahá'í Reference Library - Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 158-163 )


. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
 
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Jcc

Mar 2013
592
Edwardsville, Illinois, USA
Therefore, as God is Creator, eternal and ancient, there were always creatures and subjects existing and provided for. There is no doubt that divine sovereignty is eternal. Sovereignty necessitates subjects, ministers, trustees and others subordinate to sovereignty. Could there be a king without country, subjects and armies? If we conceive of a time when there were no creatures, no servants, no subjects of divine lordship, we dethrone God and predicate a time when God was not.
‘Abdu’l-Baha, The Promulgation of Universal Peace, page 151
 
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Feb 2019
251
Chicago
Thanks. I know that quote, but does that means that humans have always existed in their present form before they evolved on earth?

Simple questions:
==============

1. With what material did God create the cosmos and where did that material come from?
2. If God did not create the material used to create the cosmos, who created that material and who created the creator of that material?
3. If God created the physical cosmos, it means it exists outside of God. If so, there is something called space that existed outside of God in which God created the physical stars and planets. But then who created the space and how was it created? If God created space, is it separate from God or is it part of God?
4. If space is separate from God, the question remains - who created the space and how was it created?

Any discussion about creation does not satisfy human reasoning because the above questions cannot be logically answered. Long before Bahaullah said that this world is an illusion, the Hindu avatars declared that this world is a dream of God (mere thoughts of God projected on the screen of human consciousness) and so it is not real but an illusion. Just as a human dream appears real until one wakes up from the dream, God's dream projection on the screen of human consciousness appears real to human beings unless they wake up from the dream of human consciousness in to cosmic consciousness. Bahaullah says in Mathnavi-i-Mubarak,

"When you sense for sure the spirit's mystery that there is nothing anywhere but God
then wash away in spirit's stream the mire that you may see the Pure One's emanations"

Bahaullah clearly is saying that it is a mystery man has not realized that God is everywhere and God is everything. According to Vedanta school of philosophy in Hinduism, God alone is real and everything else is unreal. This cosmos which appears so real to the human senses is nothing but a dream in God's consciousness and so everything is contained in God and there is nothing other than God that exists. So from that perspective, the human soul is eternal and always was part of God. It was never created and never will it be destroyed.

"The world is but a show, vain and empty, a mere nothing, bearing the semblance of reality. Set not your affections upon it. Break not the bond that uniteth you with your Creator, and be not of those that have erred and strayed from His ways. Verily I say, the world is like the vapor in a desert, which the thirsty dreameth to be water and striveth after it with all his might, until when he cometh unto it, he findeth it to be mere illusion. It may, moreover, be likened unto the lifeless image of the beloved whom the lover hath sought and found, in the end, after long search and to his utmost regret, to be such as cannot “fatten nor appease his hunger"". - Bahaullah

"The entire universe is God's cosmic motion picture. What is matter? Nothing but a particular rate of vibration of God's cosmic energy. No form in the universe is really solid. That which appears so is merely a compact or gross vibration of His energy. The scientifically indisputable truth that matter is in reality a concentrate of energy. Man thinks of his mortal form as solid flesh and bone. That is a concrete delusion. The body is an amalgam of countless infinitesimal subatomic particles; these particles are made up of finer-than-atomic lifetronic energy and ultimately of thoughtrons, sparks of consciousness whose source is Cosmic Consciousness. Everything existing in nature is energy in a more or less compact stage of vibration, exhibiting weight according to its mass or distinguishing gravitation. The seemingly solid body is itself a nonmaterial electromagnetic wave made up ultimately of underlying astral lifetrons, which in turn are made of Cosmic Consciousness. God has ingeniously condensed His consciousness into lifetrons, lifetrons into electrons and protons, these subatomic particles into atoms, and atoms into molecules and cells—all of which live by radiations from the Cosmic Source. An actor on the movie screen seems so real; but he is nothing but radiation divided into light and shadow issuing from the projection booth. Man should realize the ethereal nature of his being—made of light and consciousness, divine and indestructible, projected on the screen of time and space by the creative Cosmic Beam of God.

In order to give individuality and independence to Its thought images, Spirit had to employ a cosmic deception, a universal mental magic. Spirit overspread and permeated Its creative desire with cosmic delusion, a grand magical measurer described in Hindu scriptures as maya (from the Sanskrit root ma, "to measure"). Delusion divides, measures out, the Undefined Infinite into finite forms and forces. The working of cosmic delusion on these individualizations is called avidya, individual illusion or ignorance, which imparts a specious reality to their existence as separate from Spirit" - Paramahansa Yogananda
 
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ams

Nov 2019
88
Thailand
(i hope it's not to much off Topic) but i just want to mention...

Also the Christ teaching is equivalent.


1. With what material did God create the cosmos and where did that material come from?
For example, John starts the Gospel with:
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God
He was in the beginning with God.
All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made.
(John 1)
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

This means that God created all of his omnipresent being which is spirit... not only the space and material and the whole universe...
But also our all own individual consciousness is made of the spirit of god.
Therefore, there never was a real seperation between God and us. This illusion of seperation... we have to overcome


Lord Jesus Christ fully realized and teached it... thus, were able to say:
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...
"I and the Father are one." (John 10,30)
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...


And so he said to us:
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...
God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth. (John 4,24)
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...



Master Yogananda - for example - also fully realized and teached it, therefore he said:
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...
When you leave the consciousness of this world behind and know that you are neither the body nor the mind,
yet you are as aware as ever of your own existence, then the divine consciousness is your true self.
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...


Brother Jesus:
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...
You are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. (John 16,16)
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...


Yogananda has giving many Affirmations for helping others for realizing our true nature:
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...
I am one with the eternal light of God, the eternal joy of Christ.
All the waves of creation are tumbling within me.
I have dissolved my body-wave in the ocean of Spirit.
I am the ocean of Spirit. No longer am I the body. My spirit is sleeping in the stones.
I am dreaming in the flowers
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

Or:

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...
I am just coming from the inner perception of my Self. I am not the body.
I am invisible. I am Joy. I am Light. I am Wisdom. I am Love.
I dwell in the dream body through which I am dreaming this earth life;
But I am ever eternal Spirit
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...


Which in the core means the same as: "God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth."


So... Yes... definitely. Baha'i, Christ and Hindu deep spiritual teaching is one.
 
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Jul 2017
511
Olympia, WA, USA
Is this what your thinking of?

“Man Has Always Existed
‘Abdu’l-Bahá states that man has always existed. Even when man did not physically exist, or when he existed in a form different than he has today, ‘Abdu’l-Bahá states that he nonetheless existed.”

This may be of interest;

Thanks, that might be what I was thinking of. I will pass that link on to my atheist friend who asked me about this.
 
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