I can't get my life back

Jul 2017
373
Olympia, WA, USA
#11
We can discuss, but if you have all the answers, why discuss? We all learn from our exchanges, we can all let go of our own ideas :):lol: ha ha...maybe not!
I certainly do not think I have all then answers, I only know what I have experienced. Maybe your experiences have been different. :think:
Who are like minded souls?
People who share our values.
The light of God is virtues, it is the virtues we have to implement within our own selves and what we only look for in others.

Like minded souls are thus those seeking virtue. This can be any person on this planet, we can only know by the light we look for. If one has 10 bad and one good quality, it is the good we see them with.
They are if we are seeking virtue. That is what I do, look at the good qualities. Everyone has them, although some people are so evil that I have to eschew their company. Those are generally not people on religious forums. I think that one way or another, people on these forums are seeking truth, and at the very least they are willing to listen to others. Those who are on a soap box are usually Christians, not atheists. That has been my experience.
Baha'u'llah has said that those that disbelieve in God are neither trustworthy or truthful, the two most important virtues.
Can you quote that. I do not believe it even if He wrote it because that is saying that no atheists are trustworthy or truthful, and I have not found that to be the case. Aside from that it makes no sense. One does not have to believe in God to be trustworthy and truthful and not all people who believe in God are trustworthy and truthful.
Thus a starting point may not be those that do not believe in God, they must at least be open to that there could be. One would end up arguing endlessly and Baha'u'llah said that is when we are both wrong.
I do not argue endlessly with atheists, but I argue endlessly with Christians. Atheists don't think they know everything but Christians generally do.

I think most atheists are willing to entertain the possibility that God exists.

Who needs us more, someone without a belief in God or someone who already believes in God? That is the way I look at it. Also, I think that if a Christian or someone of another religion is interested in the Faith they can make that move on their own. Then I am more than happy to talk to them. Otherwise I assume thay are happy with their own faith, and they usually even say that.
 
Sep 2018
76
usa
#12
Who needs us more, someone without a belief in God or someone who already believes in God?
sometimes i feel like Atheists have seen past the old religious nonsense, and are more receptive of truth.
however, i believe it would be wiser for a farmer to plant seeds in pure soils rather than non fertile land.

O SON OF DUST! The wise are they that speak not unless they obtain a hearing, even as the cup-bearer, who proffereth not his cup till he findeth a seeker, and the lover who crieth not out from the depths of his heart until he gazeth upon the beauty of his beloved. Wherefore sow the seeds of wisdom and knowledge in the pure soil of the heart, and keep them hidden, till the hyacinths of divine wisdom spring from the heart and not from mire and clay. -Bahaullah
 
May 2013
1,786
forest falls california
#13
Allah'u'Abha Trailblazer,
I have read your post and all the responses. You are not alone, but certainly feeling that way in your frustration. What goes through my head right now is that "association with the righteous cleanest the rust from off the heart", and that is what brings you here to seed fellowship with true believers in Baha'u'llah.
You wish to serve the Faith, and so you attempt to do so on Forums, but many atheists wallow in their own negativity, for they have turned away from the Blessed Beauty "from all eternity to all eternity" and this is like sticky mud on their boots and clothing and on anyone who comes near them.
So now you have all this negativity from their insults and slander, all this sticky mud that is heavy, and Baha'u'llah says to avoid evil doers and "let them choose the path to their Lord", and He says "eschew all fellowship with the unrighteous", but are you being obedient to Him in your associations? ... which are bringing you such sadness? ... Are you banging your head on a wall and complaining because it hurts all the time?

My life isn't good on many levels, too. My blessed Persian wife divorced me 15 years ago and we had 4 beautiful daughters together. One passed on to the Abha Kingdom 9 years ago, and fortunately the other three, and a granddaughter love me, and at least I have that.

I actively teach the Faith, as you do, in whatever way, observing: "Make mention of Me on My earth that in My heaven I may remember thee. Thus shall Mine eyes and thine be solaced."
So take comfort in that, but ... as regards to whom you associate with, even for the purpose of teaching, remember the Kenny Rogers song "the Gambler" ... "You've got to know when to hold 'em. Know when to fold 'em. Know when to walk away. Know when to run..."

The Bab says to use discernment in finding seekers. I wouldn't go to a KKK meeting and talk much about racial equality, and entering a room full of atheists who are hostile to the Message of Baha'u'llah may not be the right room.
 
Likes: tonyfish58
Jul 2017
373
Olympia, WA, USA
#14
sometimes i feel like Atheists have seen past the old religious nonsense, and are more receptive of truth.
however, i believe it would be wiser for a farmer to plant seeds in pure soils rather than non fertile land.

O SON OF DUST! The wise are they that speak not unless they obtain a hearing, even as the cup-bearer, who proffereth not his cup till he findeth a seeker, and the lover who crieth not out from the depths of his heart until he gazeth upon the beauty of his beloved. Wherefore sow the seeds of wisdom and knowledge in the pure soil of the heart, and keep them hidden, till the hyacinths of divine wisdom spring from the heart and not from mire and clay. -Bahaullah
The thing is, I get more hearings from agnostics and atheists than from believers. :D
That makes sense to me because the believer cup is full of another religion and the nonbeliever cup is empty. I think of things more from a psychological perspective than from a religious perspective as psychology is my other hat, and one I wore a lot longer than my religion hat. :rolleyes:

What people SAY is not always what is going on in their heads, because 95% of what is in our minds is not in conscious awareness. So I lay very low these days, and if people keep posting to me I assume it is for a reason... Now it could be they are trying to convince me of their views but that won't hurt me because i am firm in my faith... However, in the process of trying to convince me, if they are, they learn something from me, so who knows what the outcome will be? Only God knows. I try to leave my ego completely out of it, I just go where the wind of God blows me and when it blows me the other way, I go the other way.

Only once in all my six years of posting on forums have I encountered a Christian who was even the slightest bit receptive to Baha'i (I mean one who would actually listen), but after years of posting he concluded that Baha'u'llah could not be the return of Christ because of x, y and z. I think he was really trying to convince me of Christianity all that time, but we were on equal ground, each sharing our faith. We parted friends and I learned a lot from him. He will not forget the Baha'i Faith either. He is a very humble Christian who I consider far more spiritual than I am.
 
Sep 2010
4,488
Normanton Far North Queensland
#15
Can you quote that. I do not believe it even if He wrote it because that is saying that no atheists are trustworthy or truthful, and I have not found that to be the case. Aside from that it makes no sense. One does not have to believe in God to be trustworthy and truthful and not all people who believe in God are trustworthy and truthful.
It is within this passage;

"...Beware, O King, that thou gather not around thee such ministers as follow the desires of a corrupt inclination, as have cast behind their backs that which hath been committed into their hands and manifestly betrayed their trust. Be bounteous to others as God hath been bounteous to thee, and abandon not the interests of thy people to the mercy of such ministers as these. Lay not aside the fear of God, and be thou of them that act uprightly. Gather around thee those ministers from whom thou canst perceive the fragrance of faith and of justice, and take thou counsel with them, and choose whatever is best in thy sight, and be of them that act generously.
Know thou for a certainty that whoso disbelieveth in God is neither trustworthy nor truthful. This, indeed, is the truth, the undoubted truth. He that acteth treacherously towards God will, also, act treacherously towards his king. Nothing whatever can deter such a man from evil, nothing can hinder him from betraying his neighbor, nothing can induce him to walk uprightly........"

Bahá'í Reference Library - Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 232-240

Regards Tony
 
Likes: Trailblazer
Jul 2017
373
Olympia, WA, USA
#16
Allah'u'Abha Trailblazer,
I have read your post and all the responses. You are not alone, but certainly feeling that way in your frustration. What goes through my head right now is that "association with the righteous cleanest the rust from off the heart", and that is what brings you here to seed fellowship with true believers in Baha'u'llah.
You wish to serve the Faith, and so you attempt to do so on Forums, but many atheists wallow in their own negativity, for they have turned away from the Blessed Beauty "from all eternity to all eternity" and this is like sticky mud on their boots and clothing and on anyone who comes near them.
So now you have all this negativity from their insults and slander, all this sticky mud that is heavy, and Baha'u'llah says to avoid evil doers and "let them choose the path to their Lord", and He says "eschew all fellowship with the unrighteous", but are you being obedient to Him in your associations? ... which are bringing you such sadness? ... Are you banging your head on a wall and complaining because it hurts all the time?

My life isn't good on many levels, too. My blessed Persian wife divorced me 15 years ago and we had 4 beautiful daughters together. One passed on to the Abha Kingdom 9 years ago, and fortunately the other three, and a granddaughter love me, and at least I have that.

I actively teach the Faith, as you do, in whatever way, observing: "Make mention of Me on My earth that in My heaven I may remember thee. Thus shall Mine eyes and thine be solaced."
So take comfort in that, but ... as regards to whom you associate with, even for the purpose of teaching, remember the Kenny Rogers song "the Gambler" ... "You've got to know when to hold 'em. Know when to fold 'em. Know when to walk away. Know when to run..."

The Bab says to use discernment in finding seekers. I wouldn't go to a KKK meeting and talk much about racial equality, and entering a room full of atheists who are hostile to the Message of Baha'u'llah may not be the right room.
Thanks Dale. Obviously the reason I posted this last night was because I had come to the end of my rope, but not just because of atheists on forums. More of it is because as I said "I can't get my life back" because of all that has been neglected for six years. I tell myself it should not matter, they are just houses, and I have so much money and so may investments that I could never use it all. We have no children so it will all go to the Faith and animal rescue organizations. So I worry about money because it is an emotional issue I have and I know that so I just accept it, but in my logical mind I know I have no reason to worry.

Being raised in a family that had a lot of emotional issues, some genetic, with a propensity to anxiety and depression, has been a great burden even though I have overcome them for the most part. My husband was raised the same way so we are like the blind leading the blind, but we have both been Baha'is for 54 and 48 years respectively, so that is the bond, as well as our love of animals, cats in particular.

I am very impervious to insults on forums but I do get hurt by certain comments like the one I quoted in my OP. I told him how much that hurt and i think he knows. He did not apologize because he has to save face, I understand that. But we are back to posting again. Ironically, he is antagonistic to the Faith, but he still asks me a lot of questions, and even though he is a moderator he cannot complain that I am proselytizing when I answer them, for all to see. I have to think he has to be asking those questions for a reason.

I think it is owing to my childhood that I do not think I matter enough to deserve the company of Baha'is, except on forums, since they can choose to read my posts and post to me or not. I would feel like a burden in the Baha'i community if I attended any activities. Perhaps this will change some day, I live only in the present.

I like to look at the positives, so I see my association mostly with atheists as a benefit to those who would otherwise not be exposed to the Faith, since no other Baha'is are going in those trenches. I also think I understand how they think and feel, after all these years of posting to them. I was not raised in a religious home, my parents were both fallen away Christians when I grew up back in the 1950s when 95% of Americans were Christian. I do not have a foundational belief in God like most children raised in this country, so it is difficult to relate to God on any kind of emotional level.

I like that -- "You've got to know when to hold 'em. Know when to fold 'em. Know when to walk away. Know when to run..." I do know that, but sometimes I hold them a little too long. I did drop a couple of cards yesterday though and it felt good. I just cannot tolerate the disharmony and arguing about issues people believe in, and people who are very critical are the worst. No wonder Abdu’l-Baha said that the most hateful characteristic of man is fault-finding.

A certain atheist poster I mentioned in my OP I chose not to answer but after I ignore him he will come around on the adjacent forum and act differently and start asking questions. That is rare for him, but one has to use a bit of psychology, and I have that in my favor. Patience is not something I am short on. Admittedly, I have more patience with atheists than Christians.
 
Jul 2017
373
Olympia, WA, USA
#17
It is within this passage;

"...Beware, O King, that thou gather not around thee such ministers as follow the desires of a corrupt inclination, as have cast behind their backs that which hath been committed into their hands and manifestly betrayed their trust. Be bounteous to others as God hath been bounteous to thee, and abandon not the interests of thy people to the mercy of such ministers as these. Lay not aside the fear of God, and be thou of them that act uprightly. Gather around thee those ministers from whom thou canst perceive the fragrance of faith and of justice, and take thou counsel with them, and choose whatever is best in thy sight, and be of them that act generously.
Know thou for a certainty that whoso disbelieveth in God is neither trustworthy nor truthful. This, indeed, is the truth, the undoubted truth. He that acteth treacherously towards God will, also, act treacherously towards his king. Nothing whatever can deter such a man from evil, nothing can hinder him from betraying his neighbor, nothing can induce him to walk uprightly........"

Bahá'í Reference Library - Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 232-240

Regards Tony
Okay thanks Tony. Now I remember that quote. I do not think that given the context it applies to atheists in general. He was addressing a King who had power to act treacherously towards God. The atheists I talk to just don't beleive in God. I think they are pretty harmless, except to themselves.
 
Dec 2018
8
United States
#18
My life is pretty much over and I cannot get it back now. I cannot turn back the clock and get back the last six years. I have lost almost everything for these forums because Baha’u’llah said the following and I took it literally. If he did not mean it He should not have written it.....

“O ye beloved of God! Repose not yourselves on your couches, nay bestir yourselves as soon as ye recognize your Lord, the Creator, and hear of the things which have befallen Him, and hasten to His assistance. Unloose your tongues, and proclaim unceasingly His Cause. This shall be better for you than all the treasures of the past and of the future, if ye be of them that comprehend this truth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 330
If you feel your life is over because of something said on an internet forum, then you are way, way too invested in online interaction. To even think your life is over requires a vision so narrow that it is almost tragic. Really....get a piece of paper and brainstorm five things you could do offline that uphold Baha'i values. Yes, offline. Maybe it's a charity you could help with, an animal shelter or something. A soup kitchen or food pantry for the poor, perhaps. There's a whole world out there that's living, breathing and in need that you will never be able to interact with by sitting in front of your computer.

Everything in my life has gone to hell, my house, my yard, all my rental homes, my finances. What else is left? .... But it is too late now anyway, because I cannot fix all the problems I have caused by not tending to my real world duties, so I figure I might as well continue on the forums.
Err.... Probably not the best attitude. It's like saying because you're already sitting in a puddle of mud, and the mud's not going anywhere, you might as well keep sitting in the puddle of mud. It's fatalistic and ridiculous at the same time.

Right about now, I should probably give a speech about having a fighting spirit and all that, but I'm not good at such things.


I wish I were dead if I even stop to think about what my life has become, but I do not want to go to the afterlife, ever. I hate the idea of living forever. All I can think about is living forever in hell because that is all I have ever known in this life.
Really, take a break from forums for a while. And while you're at it, order a copy of the book, Why Me? by Justice Saint Rain. It's a book by a Baha'i author that discusses how to deal with trials and tribulations in life. I highly recommend it. (Check your private messages for further details.)

I want nothing to do with Baha’is except on forums because the Baha’is in my community have a life and I don’t. I feel like an island onto myself because I take what Baha’u’llah wrote too literally, and I do not think any other Baha’i would ever understand how I feel.
The idea that other people cannot relate to you is preposterous. Really. It's almost vanity to assume that you and your problems are so special that no one can understand. Believe me, I understand isolation. I don't want to compare, but I'm willing to bet I've experienced far more isolation than you have in life--presently, at the very least. I don't know your past, only what you've said about your present.

On the other hand, I am not even fit to even be a Baha’i because I can’t do anything for the Faith except go on forums. I have wanted to hand in my card but I can’t because I still believe in Baha’u’llah.
Err... I have problems with this too. I don't think you've taken Baha'u'llah too literally. I think you've merely defined what Baha'u'llah's words mean for you far too narrowly. You've pigeon-holed yourself. You've got blinders on your eyes that prevent you from seeing other options about what to do with your life. You see only what you expect to see, which isn't a very full picture of what's out there.

The irony about all this is that I do not even like God, let alone love God, I am just trying to do the right thing by Baha’u’llah. I wish I knew what God wants me to do but He is not talking. I am in so much pain. Doesn’t God even know that or care? Sometimes I think He does care and the message is that I should not care about my material world life because it just does not matter.
Good Lord, you really have to read Why Me? by Justice Saint Rain. I'm not kidding. Read it.

I'm going to call it night for now, but I hope to continue this conversation later. Perhaps, with the help of others on this forum, we can get you to see life beyond the internet. Of course, that means you'll have to eventually spend some time away from us for a while, but I'm sure you'll manage.
 
Jul 2017
373
Olympia, WA, USA
#19
If you feel your life is over because of something said on an internet forum, then you are way, way too invested in online interaction. To even think your life is over requires a vision so narrow that it is almost tragic. Really....get a piece of paper and brainstorm five things you could do offline that uphold Baha'i values. Yes, offline. Maybe it's a charity you could help with, an animal shelter or something. A soup kitchen or food pantry for the poor, perhaps. There's a whole world out there that's living, breathing and in need that you will never be able to interact with by sitting in front of your computer.

Err.... Probably not the best attitude. It's like saying because you're already sitting in a puddle of mud, and the mud's not going anywhere, you might as well keep sitting in the puddle of mud. It's fatalistic and ridiculous at the same time.

Right about now, I should probably give a speech about having a fighting spirit and all that, but I'm not good at such things.

Really, take a break from forums for a while. And while you're at it, order a copy of the book, Why Me? by Justice Saint Rain. It's a book by a Baha'i author that discusses how to deal with trials and tribulations in life. I highly recommend it. (Check your private messages for further details.)

The idea that other people cannot relate to you is preposterous. Really. It's almost vanity to assume that you and your problems are so special that no one can understand. Believe me, I understand isolation. I don't want to compare, but I'm willing to bet I've experienced far more isolation than you have in life--presently, at the very least. I don't know your past, only what you've said about your present.

Err... I have problems with this too. I don't think you've taken Baha'u'llah too literally. I think you've merely defined what Baha'u'llah's words mean for you far too narrowly. You've pigeon-holed yourself. You've got blinders on your eyes that prevent you from seeing other options about what to do with your life. You see only what you expect to see, which isn't a very full picture of what's out there.

Good Lord, you really have to read Why Me? by Justice Saint Rain. I'm not kidding. Read it.

I'm going to call it night for now, but I hope to continue this conversation later. Perhaps, with the help of others on this forum, we can get you to see life beyond the internet. Of course, that means you'll have to eventually spend some time away from us for a while, but I'm sure you'll manage.
This is not a conversation, it is you telling me what you think I should do and psychoanalyzing me. Admittedly, I laid myself open by posting what I did and trusting Baha'is to be understanding. I did not want advice, just understanding and compassion. Did I ask for advice? No, I was just venting. That day was just a snapshot in time. I feel that way sometimes, but my life is not over. I am more than happy to sacrifice everything I have for the Cause of God, I do not need a life for myself. It just scares me sometimes when I realize that so many other things have gone by the wayside, but I will figure out what to do about it, I always do.

I am not taking a break from my forums. After five years, one atheist who spit in my face and in the face of Baha'u'llah and God is asking questions about God and Baha'u'llah. I do not know if he is seriously interested but I do not try to figure out why he is asking. Every human being matters to me. There is no way I would ever walk away from anyone who is posting to me because there has to be a reason, and I do not need to know what it is. It is in the hands of God.

I know you are just trying to help me, it it does not help to speak for people and assume you know what they are thinking and feeling, or what they need to do. Just because you have certain problems that does not mean they are the same problems I have. We are separate people. Whatever solutions might work for you will not work for me. I have to make my own way.

I interact with people all day long at work. I have no interest in interacting with anyone after I get home from work, except online. I can interact with a lot more people online than I could in person, and it suits me just fine. I am an introvert, and I do enjoy socializing in person. There is no reason why I should force myself.
 
Jun 2006
4,316
California
#20
I'm reminded of a statement on prayer I found this evening in "A Traveler's Narrative":

"O friends, consort with all the people of the world with joy and fragrance. If there be to you a word or essence whereof others than you are devoid, communicate it and show it forth in the language of affection and kindness: if it be received and be effective the object is attained, and if not leave it to him, and with regard to him deal not harshly but pray. The language of kindness is the lodestone of hearts and the food of the soul; it stands in the relation of ideas to words, and is as an horizon for the shining of the Sun of Wisdom and Knowledge."

~ Abdu'l-Baha, A Traveller's Narrative, p. 43
 

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