Nazarethan Baha'i faith view of prayer from death

Apr 2013
166
Dorset , UK
#11
The only thing you produce is meaningless words, intended to upset people. Don't you ever feel ashamed of yourself, naughty boy?

gnat
Hadiths is words of Muhammad, so you claim he is naughty?
Verses from Deuteronomy is words of Moses, so for you his revelation is also false?
 
Jun 2014
1,080
Wisconsin
#12
Walrus, you and Bahais do the same wrong way worship by prayers death like catholics or ortodox Christians, pray for death is abomination and bring the calamity
[Citation Needed]

Immams are clergy of Shia Islam . Shia Islam is corrupted Islam, they thinks that words of Immams is equal words of God like Quran and Bible, and this is the false religion and tradition.
[Citation Needed]. From "Babism". A name that invokes a person who confirmed the Imams of the Twelvers.

Sunni Muslims haven't any clergy,sunni Immams are only like Baha'i counselors
Councilors: Work to stimulate the growth and vibrancy of the Bahá’í community, promoting the development of its spiritual, intellectual, and social life.

Imams: Study scriptures and Hadith, issuing fatwas to establish fiqh and establishing the authenticity or inauthenticity of Hadith.

Those two stations are not alike.

Sunni hadith of Muhammad forbidden pray for death

“Beware of those who preceded you and used to take the graves of their prophets and righteous men as places of worship, but you must not take graves as mosques; I forbid you to do that.” (Sahih Muslim)
“May Allah’s curse be on the Jews for they built the places of worship at the graves of their Prophets.” (Sahih Bukhari)
“May Allah curse the Jews and Christians for they built the places of worship at the graves of their Prophets.” (Sahih Bukhari)
“If any religious man dies amongst those people they would build a place of worship at his grave and make these pictures in it. They will be the worst creature in the sight of Allah on the Day of Resurrection.” (Sahih Bukhari)
“Do not sit on the graves and do not pray facing towards them.” (Sahih Bukhari)
Even if I was willing to accept the validity of Sunni Hadith, these Hadith verses all forbid worship at graveyards or building mosques atop a grave. This action is not the same as the action of praying for the dead. Once again the verses you cite don't even remotely come close to saying what you claim they do or supporting your position. :p

Once again, you conflate praying for the dead with things that are only tangentially similar. :cool:

Offer a citation that directly supports what you wish to say, or stop misquoting things. :p

Hadiths is words of Muhammad, so you claim he is naughty?
Verses from Deuteronomy is words of Moses, so for you his revelation is also false?
I don't generally like Hadith for many reasons (overall, the existence of a Quran should negate any need for Hadith), but even assuming those Hadiths you have provided ARE the words of Muhammad, neither the Hadiths you site, Surah you cite, nor the Deuteronomy verses you cite even mention praying for the dead. You falsely conflate praying to with praying for, or falsely conflate conjuration of with praying for, or falsely conflate praying at a grave to praying for the dead. I won't speak for Gnat, but I'd suspect he is calling you naughty for misquoting things, not calling the scriptures naughty, because not a single scripture you cited supports your arguments. :p Learn to cite sources better please.

Your current quality of scripture citation is like saying "the bible forbids loving yourself" because Mark 12:31 reads "Love your neighbor as yourself." The verse cited does not actually support the ridiculous claim. :rolleyes:
 
Oct 2014
1,797
Stockholm
#13
It's more simple than that. Someone here has figured out what we as Bahá'ís abhor the most and then delivers it, like a child who has learned nasty words at school. So, I just give him what he's asking for, out of the kindness of my heart.

Personally, I'm now rapidly losing interest in this site. It's contaminated.

gnat
 
Apr 2013
166
Dorset , UK
#14
Walrus, don't mix will of God and warnings with hatred, God want to rescue you by his Holy Words, don't reject Him, if you don't recognise Bible as word of God and infallible words of God, you and others lay in deep abomination, I speak what do you dislike, this is message to today world
 
Jun 2014
1,080
Wisconsin
#15
Walrus, don't mix will of God and warnings with hatred, God want to rescue you by his Holy Words, don't reject Him, if you don't recognise Bible as word of God and infallible words of God, you and others lay in deep abomination, I speak what do you dislike, this is message to today world
I don't reject the words. I recognize the words for what they say.

I'd say one who reads the Word and decides to invent their own meaning is one who rejects the Word in their heart.

One who accepts the Word of God has no need to invent new meaning.

I accept the words when they read "don't build a shrine at a graveyard", and I have not built any shrines at any graveyards. :p I don't reject the verse by making up my own meanings.

It is rejection of the Word of God when one reads "don't build a shrine at a graveyard" and decides to make up their own meaning of "don't pray for the dead."

Pawel, to truly accept the Word of God and the Bible as Truth, you must be willing to accept that the verses say only what they say, and not what you, personally, want them to say.

None of the verses you have quoted here on this thread have you truly accepted, for you reject their meanings and invent your own.

I personally accept scripture as written and nothing more. That is what accepting the Word of God is.

To say that any of the verses you cited forbid "praying for the dead" when none of them say this is a rejection of these verses.

If you have not rejected the Word of God, then simply explain, how do you read the words “Do not sit on the graves and do not pray facing towards them”, as just one example, and think that forbids praying for someone who has died?? Explain how that Hadith says what you claim, if you do not in fact reject that Hadith.

Also: You never answer my questions. Ever. :(
 
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Apr 2013
166
Dorset , UK
#16
I see walrus and other mainstream Bahais only get philosophy, I don't judge you, I'm no without sins, but mainstream Bahais will go to wide way strait lead to hell, you call laught walrus, for you hell is only "metaphorical " , when be to late, I am only warnings. God is not made from water and flour like eucharist, I am no Catholic, Catholicism isn't not Christianity, be true Christianity meaning follower of Jesus in every his words, I try to be good Christian, Muslim, baha'i and Sikh
 
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Jun 2014
1,080
Wisconsin
#17
Well, trying to approach this rationally won't work.

Maybe I'll try approaching Pawel in Pawel's own writing style.

Step 1: Ignore everything he says.
Step 2: Tell him to read the bible because he is wrong.
Step 3: Offer no proof of his being incorrect.
Step 4: Insert accusative language.
Step 5: Add in completely unrelated claim to the discussion for no reason, offer no proof. :p

Proper Pawel Response To Pawel:

"Pawel, you really need to read the bible and stop denying Christ's Word!! I don't judge, but you're totally on the path to hell because you reject the Word of God. Read the bible more because you are wrong. The bible teaches that eating bats is blasphemy. Read the bible, stop denying the Word of God. You just need to have more faith in God." :p ;)
 
Apr 2013
166
Dorset , UK
#18
Whatever laughing and mistranslated Bible will be sent calamity from God
Bible say :
" Matthew 24:37-39King James Version (KJV)
37But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be"

2 Peter 3:4-10
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2+Peter+3:4-10&version=NKJV

Baha’u'llah was only spiritual return of Jesus but not physical return of son of God , Jesus return how is writing in Zechariah 14:4, it's not symbolical this is true
 
Jun 2014
1,080
Wisconsin
#20
Oh thanks, I almost forgot a step.

Step 1: Ignore everything he says.
Step 2: Tell him to read the bible because he is wrong.
Step 3: Offer no proof of his being incorrect.
Step 4: Insert accusative language.
Step 5: Add in completely unrelated claim to the discussion for no reason, offer no proof.
Step 6: Accuse other of laughter.

"Pawel, you're wrong and on the path to evil. Go read the Bible so you can free yourself from Satan's clutches. You are supposed to call to prayer with voice and not bell. Bells are evil. You may laugh, but this is only because you deny God's word and need to read the bible."
 

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