Second Coming in the Quran..

Dec 2010
217
Pittsburgh
I believe that the Bab was the Mahdi, who was the anti Christ? Give me some guidents fellow bahais.


Second coming[edit]

See also: Second Coming#Islam and Islamic eschatology

According to Islamic tradition which describes this graphically, Jesus' descent will be in the midst of wars fought by the Mahdi (lit. "the rightly guided one"), known in Islamic eschatology as the redeemer of Islam, against the Antichrist (al-Masīh ad-Dajjāl, "False messiah") and his followers.[27] Jesus will descend at the point of a white arcade, east of Damascus, dressed in yellow robes—his head anointed. He will then join the Mahdi in his war against the Dajjal. Jesus, considered as a Muslim, will abide by the Islamic teachings. Eventually, Jesus will slay the Antichrist, and then everyone from the People of the Book (ahl al-kitāb, referring to Jews and Christians) will believe in him. Thus, there will be one community, that of Islam.[28]

Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 43: Kitab-ul-`Ilm (Book of Knowledge), Hâdith Number 656:


The Hour will not be established until the son of Mary (i.e. Jesus) descends amongst you as a just ruler, he will break the cross, kill the pigs, and abolish the Jizya tax. Money will be in abundance so that nobody will accept it (as charitable gifts).

After the death of the Mahdi, Jesus will assume leadership. This is a time associated in Islamic narrative with universal peace and justice. Islamic texts also allude to the appearance of Ya'juj and Ma'juj (known also as Gog and Magog), ancient tribes which will disperse and cause disturbance on earth. God, in response to Jesus' prayers, will kill them by sending a type of worm in the napes of their necks.[27] Jesus' rule is said to be around forty years, after which he will die. Muslims will then perform the funeral prayer for him and then bury him in the city of Medina in a grave left vacant beside Muhammad, Abu Bakr, and Umar (companions of Muhammad and the first and second Sunni caliphs (Rashidun) respectively).[6]
 
May 2013
1,786
forest falls california
Anti-Christ

I believe that the Bab was the Mahdi, who was the anti Christ? Give me some guidents fellow bahais.

>>>> "We do not believe in the Anti-Christ in the sense the Christians do. Anyone who violently and determinedly sought to oppose the Manifestation could be called an 'anti-Christ', such as the Vazir in the Bab's day, Haji Mirza Aqasi." (Shoghi Effendi, Lights of Guidance [hereafter LOG] #987, pp. 366-67; Note however, that Shoghi Effendi gives us the Biblical definition of the "antichrist")

"Siyyid Muhammad, the Antichrist of the Bahá'í Revelation ... the Antichrist of the Babi Revelation, Haji Mirza Aqasi ..." (Shoghi Effendi, God Passes By, [hereafter GPB] 164)

I have read elsewhere that Siyyid Muhammad led Mirza Yahya astray, and is referred to as the "anti-Christ" of the Baha'i Dispensation.


See also: Second Coming#Islam and Islamic eschatology

>>> Probably we need to wait for a more educated response from someone of capacity here, but from what I've read of these various Hadiths is something like reading Daniel or the Book of Revelation. There is much imagery, and perhaps imagination by the authors, and who knows how second hand and "interpreted" they are. Evidently (to me), there is some truth in the visions.
The Bab and Baha'u'llah were contemporaries. Which is regarded as which gets confusing, even in Baha'i quotes, for Baha'u'llah speaks of Himself as the One Manifestation who appears in these various human garbs. So does the Bab, but from Gleanings comes the following quote:

"Praise be to Thee, O Lord My God, for the wondrous revelations of Thy inscrutable decree and the manifold woes and trials Thou hast destined for Myself. At one time Thou didst deliver Me into the hands of Nimrod; at another Thou hast allowed Pharaoh’s rod to persecute Me. Thou, alone, canst estimate, through Thine all-encompassing knowledge and the operation of Thy Will, the incalculable afflictions I have suffered at their hands. Again Thou didst cast Me into the prison-cell of the ungodly, for no reason except that I was moved to whisper into the ears of the well-favored denizens of Thy Kingdom an intimation of the vision with which Thou hadst, through Thy knowledge, inspired Me, and revealed 89 to Me its meaning through the potency of Thy might. And again Thou didst decree that I be beheaded by the sword of the infidel. Again I was crucified for having unveiled to men’s eyes the hidden gems of Thy glorious unity, for having revealed to them the wondrous signs of Thy sovereign and everlasting power. How bitter the humiliations heaped upon Me, in a subsequent age, on the plain of Karbilá! How lonely did I feel amidst Thy people! To what a state of helplessness I was reduced in that land! Unsatisfied with such indignities, My persecutors decapitated Me, and, carrying aloft My head from land to land paraded it before the gaze of the unbelieving multitude, and deposited it on the seats of the perverse and faithless. In a later age, I was suspended, and My breast was made a target to the darts of the malicious cruelty of My foes. My limbs were riddled with bullets, and My body was torn asunder. Finally, behold how, in this Day, My treacherous enemies have leagued themselves against Me, and are continually plotting to instill the venom of hate and malice into the souls of Thy servants. With all their might they are scheming to accomplish their purpose…. Grievous as is My plight, O God, My Well-Beloved, I render thanks unto Thee, and My Spirit is grateful for whatsoever hath befallen me in the path of Thy good-pleasure. I am well pleased with that which Thou didst ordain for Me, and welcome, 90 however calamitous, the pains and sorrows I am made to suffer."

Note: I know this isn't exactly on track with your question, but the above just blows me away!! ;-)
 

Jcc

Mar 2013
593
Edwardsville, Illinois, USA
For Baha'is the Quran is authoritative but the Hadith is not. And even though the Quran and the Bible are the Word of God, the prophecies about the resurrection, the return of Christ and the end of the old world order are not properly understood by Muslims and Christians. The Kitab-I-Iqan makes it clear that they are symbolic, so we should study that book to understand the prophecies.
 
Sep 2010
1,758
Louisiana
mixed Messiahs

In my opinion SOME ANSWERED QUESTIONS talks about the prophecies in Revelations, St John, which concern the coming of Muhhammad which is where information on the Anti-Christ you refer to can be found. You are mixing up different Revelations with a question that cannot be answered exactly. It is an inaccurate question. I highly reccommend reading SAQ.

(I would like to know how you see Baha'is as not worshipping God as you asked that question. :confused:)

The majority of participants here are not scholars, but every day Baha'is and Westerners. However there are scholars such as Susan Maneck who could answer questions if she were online with us. Baha'is in general know a great deal more about our Faith than Christians in my opinion. Most of us will know part of an answer to your questions. VERY few have an Islamic background and I hope you will bear that in mind. Sorry for that for you.

I cannot speak to the Hadith. Nearly no one can, but a few have already mentioned the limitations of the Hadith. Prophecy is a difficult subject, yes?
 
Last edited:
Sep 2010
1,758
Louisiana
The Bab and Baha'u'llah were contemporaries. Which is regarded as which gets confusing, even in Baha'i quotes, for Baha'u'llah speaks of Himself as the One Manifestation who appears in these various human garbs. So does the Bab, but from Gleanings comes the following quote:

"Praise be to Thee, O Lord My God, for the wondrous revelations of Thy inscrutable decree and the manifold woes and trials Thou hast destined for Myself. At one time Thou didst deliver Me into the hands of Nimrod; at another Thou hast allowed Pharaoh’s rod to persecute Me. Thou, alone, canst estimate, through Thine all-encompassing knowledge and the operation of Thy Will, the incalculable afflictions I have suffered at their hands. Again Thou didst cast Me into the prison-cell of the ungodly, for no reason except that I was moved to whisper into the ears of the well-favored denizens of Thy Kingdom an intimation of the vision with which Thou hadst, through Thy knowledge, inspired Me, and revealed 89 to Me its meaning through the potency of Thy might. And again Thou didst decree that I be beheaded by the sword of the infidel. Again I was crucified for having unveiled to men’s eyes the hidden gems of Thy glorious unity, for having revealed to them the wondrous signs of Thy sovereign and everlasting power. How bitter the humiliations heaped upon Me, in a subsequent age, on the plain of Karbilá! How lonely did I feel amidst Thy people! To what a state of helplessness I was reduced in that land! Unsatisfied with such indignities, My persecutors decapitated Me, and, carrying aloft My head from land to land paraded it before the gaze of the unbelieving multitude, and deposited it on the seats of the perverse and faithless. In a later age, I was suspended, and My breast was made a target to the darts of the malicious cruelty of My foes. My limbs were riddled with bullets, and My body was torn asunder. Finally, behold how, in this Day, My treacherous enemies have leagued themselves against Me, and are continually plotting to instill the venom of hate and malice into the souls of Thy servants. With all their might they are scheming to accomplish their purpose…. Grievous as is My plight, O God, My Well-Beloved, I render thanks unto Thee, and My Spirit is grateful for whatsoever hath befallen me in the path of Thy good-pleasure. I am well pleased with that which Thou didst ordain for Me, and welcome, 90 however calamitous, the pains and sorrows I am made to suffer."

Note: I know this isn't exactly on track with your question, but the above just blows me away!! ;-)
I agreee with this quote as being relevent though I can't say why especially either. I am learning by studying others questions, that is for sure.
cp
 
Jun 2006
4,321
California
It might be of interest if we offered some Hadiths I collected some time ago from various sources...

Harun Yahya asked:


In his hadiths the Prophet (saas) told us that the Mahdi will be opposed to terror and violence, and that the anarchic environment and all acts of terror will come to an end in his day.

The hadiths state that in the time of the Mahdi all weapons will fall silent and wars will come to an end:

War will lay down its burden (arms and the like). (Sunan Ibn Majah, 10/334; Imam Sharani)

No Blood Will Be Shed in the Time of the Mahdi

Again according to the hadiths,

the Mahdi will bring justice to the whole world, but not one single drop of blood will be shed. The Mahdi will be opposed to terror and violence. War and conflict will come to an end. Yet the Mahdi will follow a very peaceful path as he does all this. This attribute of the Mahdi is set out as follows in the hadith:

In the same way that bees gather round the queen, so people will gather round the Mahdi. He will fill the world, once filled with oppression, with justice instead. Such will be his justice that the sleeping man will not be awakened and no blood will be shed. The world will return to the Age of Happiness.

(al-Qawl al-Mukhtasar, pp. 29 and 48)

Al-Baqir:

"When the Qa'im from the family of Muhammad may God bless Him and His family arises He will set up encampments and He will teach the people the Qur'an as it was revealed by God the Mighty and High. The greatest difficulty will be for those who have learnt it as it is today because it differs from its (original) composition."


Jafar al- Sadiq:

"When the Qa'im arises peace be upon Him, He will come with a new commandment (from God) just as the Apostle of God, may God bless Him and His family summoned (men) to a new commandment (from God) at the beginning of Islam".


Traditions of the Qa’im:

When the Qa'im rises he will come with a new commission, just as the Prophet in the beginning of Islam called the people to a new commission

Ithbat al-hudat Vol. 7, p. 110.

When the Prophet was appointed people worshipped stones and wood. However, when our Qa'im arises people will interpret the ordinances of God against his interpretation, and will argue with him and dispute by means of the Qur'an. By God, the justice of the Qa'im will enter inside their homes, just as the heat and the cold enter them.

Ithbat al-hudat, Vol. 7, p. 86.


I can witness the Qa'im wearing the particular garment and taking out the letter of the Prophet sealed with a golden seal, and after breaking the seal he reads aloud to the people. The people disperse from him as the sheep do from the shepherd. And no one besides his vizier and eleven chiefs remain with him. Then people begin to search for a reformer everywhere. But, since they do not find anyone besides him who can help them, they rush towards him. By God, I know what the Qa'im is telling them which they refuse to acknowledge

Bihar al-anwar, Vol. 52, p. 326.


There will dawn a time when there will remain nothing but a trace from the Qur'an. And from Islam there will survive only a name. There will be people called Muslims, but they will be the farthest of all other people from Islam. They will have well built mosques; but these will be devoid of guidance

Bihar al-anwar, Vol. 52, p. 190.

"The sacred Books will be ornate, the mosques disguised, the minarets extended. Criminals will be praised, the lines of combat narrowed, hearts in disaccord and pacts broken. Women, greedy for the riches of this lower world, will involve themselves in the business of their husbands, the vicious voices of the man will be loud and will be listened to. The most ignoble of the people will become leaders, the debauched will be believed for fear of the Evil they will cause, the liar will be considered as truthful and the traitor as trustworthy… They will resort to singers and musical instruments … and women will horse ride, they will resemble men and the men will resemble women. The people will prefer the activities of this lower-world to those of the Higher-World and will cover with lambskin the hearts of wolves."

al-Kulayi, Us G1 K.K al-Hujjan, Bab MS JS a fi l-ithna' ashar, 11/468-485; al-Nu'Mani, K al-Ghayba,bab., p. 201, 281. Ibn-Babuye, Kamal al-Din, Bab-5 24-38, p. 256, 385, see also Id, Hal, Bab 12; Nahj-al-Balagha, p. 295, 424, 425, 458, 1158. 1180, 1222. Kamal, bab 47, l,11/525-28


It is the universal initiation by the imam of all men into the secrets of existence and of their own religions, and this is without doubt the meaning which must be understood by the term Mahdi given by the fifth imam al-Bagir: Mahdi (the Guide) is named as such because it is he who will guide (Yahdi) us in the secret teachings."

al-Nu'mani, bab 14, p. 342

"The Mahdi will extract the Torah and the other Divine Books from their caverns and will judge amongst the faithful of the Evangiles according to the Evangiles, amongst the faithful of al-Zabur (The Book of David) according to the al-Zabur and amongst the faithful of the Koran according to the Koran."

Ibn Babunye, bab 129, 1/161; Ibn-Ayyash, Mugrad-Ab, 18159


Prophecies related to Baha’u’llah (the Return of Christ) in the
Traditions (Hadiths)

The following are prophecies from the major books of Sunni Hadiths which
Baha’is believe were fulfilled by Baha’u’llah (see also later). Baha’is
believe that Baha’u’llah was the return of Christ (al-Masi:

The Descent of Jesus

>From the Sahih of al-BukhᲭ:
Narrated by Ab?ayra:

God's Messenger said, `The Hour will not be
established until the son of Mary (i.e. Jesus) descends amongst you as a
just ruler, he will break the cross, kill the pigs, and abolish the Jizyah tax. Money will be in abundance so that nobody will accept it (as charitable gifts).'(10)

Baha’is interpret

`break the cross, kill the pigs, and abolish the
Jizyah tax'

as meaning that on his return, Jesus will have the full
authority of a Messenger of God. He will supercede the previous religions and abrogate and replace their laws. This is expressed symbolically in this Tradition as:

he will `break the cross'
(superceding Christianity),

`kill the pigs' (for food, abrogating the
laws of Judaism)

and `abolish the Jizya' (superceding the Islamic
Shari`ah).

Baha’u’llah did all of this both symbolically and, in the
case of abolishing the prohibition on eating pork and the Jizyah tax, literally also.


His Ministry will be for Forty Years

>From the Sunan of Ab??arrated by Ab?ayra:

The Prophet (peace be upon him) said:

There is no prophet between me and him, that is, Jesus (peace be upon him). He will descend (to the earth) . . . He (Jesus) will destroy the Antichrist (the Dajjᬩ and will live on the earth for forty years and then he will die.(11)

Baha‘u‘llah‘s ministry lasted forty years (1852-92).

(Concerning the
Dajjᬬ see later).


The Establishment of a New Religion and the Opposition of the `Ulama

Im᭠`Abd al-Wahhᢠal-Sha`rᮭ records in his book, al-Yawᱭt wa'l-
Jawᨩr:

He will cause to appear a religion that he holds within himself which even were the Messenger of God (Muhammad) to be alive, he would judge according to it. And in his time, there will only remain this religion, purified from personal opinion. The schools (madhᨩb) of the `ulama will oppose most of his ordinances (ahk᭩hi). And they will be dismayed
at him on account of this for they will consider that, after their leadership, God will not allow a single mujtahid to remain.(12)


God will change the Arab people for Persians

>From the Sahih of at-Tirmidh Ab?ayra said:

Some of the companions of the Messenger of God (upon
him be greetings and praise) said: `O Messenger of God! Who are those people about whom God has said that if we turn back (from the Path), He will substitute in our stead another people and they would not be like us (Qur'ᮠ47:38)?' And Salman (the Persian) was beside the Messenger of
God and the Messenger of God struck him (on the thigh) and took Salman and said:

`This man and his people. By the One in whose hand is my soul! Were faith to be suspended in the Pleiades men from among the Persians would attain unto it.'(13)

The majority of the early followers of the Bab and Baha’u’llah were
Persians


The Last Remaining Supporter of the Mahdi will come to `Akka In al-Futuhᴠal-Makkiyyah, Shaykh Muhyi ad-Dibn al-`Arabecords
the following hadith concerning the Mahdi and his supporters or
ministers (wuzar᩺

He (the Mahdi) will emerge at a time of decline in religion. God will constrain through him what was not constrained though the Qur'an such that a man who is ignorant, cowardly and miserly one evening will be transformed to being learned, brave and generous on the morrow . . . He
will witness the most mighty battle (Armageddon), the banquet of God, upon the plain of `Akka He will banish tyranny and those who espouse it and he will revive religion . . . His martyrs will be the best of
martyrs and his trusted ones the most excellent of trustees. In order to help him, God has kept hidden in a secret place a people whom He has made aware of the concealed and revealed realities of things and of whatever God has ordained for His servants. And they will make their
decisions through their consultations . . . And his supporters whom God has caused to help him - in accordance with His words

`It is incumbent upon Us to help the believers (Qur'ᮠ30:47)' -

they will follow in the footsteps of those of the companions (of the Prophet) who held true to the covenant that they had made with God. And they will all be Persians, there being no Arabs among them, but they will speak Arabic . . . They
are the most favoured of the supporters and the most excellent of the trustees . . . And all of them will be killed except one who will be upon the plain of `Akka the divine table that God has laid out for all creatures.(14)

The Bab(the Mahdi emerged at the time of the decline of the religion
of Islam and ordained new laws and teachings to revive religion.
Concerning his leading followers (the text used the word vaz plural
wuzarᬠ which can be translated as `supporters' or `ministers', but
which I have rendered here as `leading followers'), they were mostly
Persians, but being of the religious class, they spoke Arabic. All of
the leading disciples of the Bab were martyred in Iran and, of the rest,
the most prominent was Baha’u’llah who was exiled to `Akka in Syria.


This Tradition mentions making decisions through consultation which is
what the Baha’is do (see p. XXX). The table with food laid out is also
mentioned in the Qur'an (5:112-115) as being a miracle of Christ, here
being mentioned in relation to the returned Christ. Baha’is consider
that it refers to a heavenly feast of spiritual food.



NOTES

10. Al-Bukhari, Sahih Book 43 - Oppressions , no. 656, vol. 3, p. 395;
at-TirmidhSah Abwᢠal-Fitan, vol. 9, p. 75-7

11. Ab?Sunan, 37 - Kitab Al-Malᨩm, vol. 2, p. 432; Ibn
Hanbal, Musnad, vol. 4, p. 406

12. Ash-Sha`rᮭ, al-Yawᱭt wa'l-Jawᨩr, vol. 2, ch. 65, p. 143. Al-
Sha`rᮩ states that he is quoting Ibn `Arabal-Fut?al-Makkiyyah,
apparently from chapter 366 on `Knowing the station of the supporters of
the Mahdi who will appear at the end of time', vol. 3, pp. 106, but the
wording is slightly different in the text of Ibn `Arabi in the edition
that I have used (see Bibliography). In Shi`ah Traditions there are
similar statements, but these are about the Mahdi however: a new book
and a new religion:

`He will come with a new Cause - just as Muhammad,
at the beginning of Islam, summoned the people to a new Cause - and with a new book'; opposition of the `ulamah o the MahdI The Qa’im [Mahd흊will come to a people who will interpret the Book of God against him and will bring proofs from it against him'; both Traditions are in al-
Nu`mᮭ, al-Ghayba quoted in MajlisBihᲠal-AnwᲠ(lithograph ed.),
vol. 13, p. 192-3.

13. At-TirmidhSah Abwab at-Tafsir, Chapter on the Tafsof S?f Muhammad, vol. 12, p. 146. At-Tirmidhives several chains of
transmission for this had and another similar one. English
translation may be found in at-Tibr, Mishkat al-Masabih, vol. 4, p.
1375. The Shi`i commentary on the Qur'an al-Fayd al-K᳨ᮭ, Kitᢠas-
S᦭, quotes a similar Tradition, vol. 2, p. 572-3

14. Ibn al-`Arabi al-Fut?al-Makkiyyah, chapter 366 on `Knowing the
station of the supporters of the Mahdho will appear at the end of
time', vol. 3, pp. 106-8. See also ash-Sha`rᮭ, al-Yawᱭt wa'l-
Jawᨩr, vol. 2, ch. 65, p. 143-4.

--
Dr Moojan Momen
Sorry, cannot access /religion/bahaist/m9684.html | escribeHOST


Sermon 147 Nahjul-Balaghah


On the future

Certainly, a time will come upon you after me when nothing will be more concealed than rightfulness, nothing more apparent than wrongfulness and nothing more current than untruth against Allah and His Prophet. For the people of this period nothing will be more valueless than the Qur'an being recited as it ought to be recited, nor anything more valuable than the Qur'an being misplaced from its position. And in the towns nothing will be more hated than virtue, nor anything more acceptable than vice.
The holders of the book will throw it away and its memorisers would forget it. In these days the Qur'an and its people will be exiled and expelled. They will be companions keeping together on one path, but no one will offer them asylum. Consequently at this time the Qur'an and its people will be among the people but not among them, will be with them but not with them, because misguidance cannot accord with guidance even though they may be together. The people will have united on division and will therefore have cut away from the community, as though they were the leaders of the Qur'an and not the Qur'an their leader. Nothing of it will be left with them except its name, and they will know nothing save its writing and its words. Before that, they will inflict hardships on the virtuous, naming the latter's truthful views about Allah false allegations, and enforcing for virtues the punishment of the vice.
Those before you passed away because of the lengthening of their desires and the forgetting of their death, till that promised event befell them about which excuses are turned down, repentance is denied and punishment and retribution is inflicted.

Source:


Nahj al-Balaghah




According to the Shia and Sunni versions of the Islamic eschatology the Mahdi (مهدي Mhdī, also Mehdi; "Guided One") is the prophesied redeemer of Islam who will stay on earth seven, nine, or nineteen years (depending on the interpretation[1]) before the coming of the day, Yawm al-Qiyamah (literally "Day of the Resurrection" or "Day of the Standing").[2] Muslims believe the Mahdi will rid the world of error, injustice and tyranny alongside Jesus.[3] The concept of Mahdi is not explicitly mentioned in the Qu'ran nor in the Sunni hadiths such as Sahih al-Bukhari which only mention the second coming of Jesus.[4][5] It is only one of the six books of hadīth. Some orthodox Sunnī theologians accordingly question Mahdist beliefs[5], but such beliefs form a necessary part of Shīʿī doctrine.[4]

Article on Mahdi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Sep 2010
1,758
Louisiana
Good for Athra!

Words fail me when I reccommend the book THE GATE OF THE HEART by Nasser Saiedi which describes the Revelation of the Bayan much as Balyuzi did in THE REVELATION OF BAHA'U'LLAH in 4 volumes. It is much more complex than I can describe and very, very uplifting by the way it reveals that complexity to less than scholars such as myself. It is not available online.
cp
 
Jun 2011
1,543
Somewhere "in this immensity"
I missed out on this thread! It looks like everyone worked it out quite well. How disappointing to learn that the anti Christ was not Napoleon or Kissinger after all. Heck, I don't even think Haji Mirza Aqasi wore a suit and a tie! :rolleyes: Oh well! The main thing is, that he lost. :yes: