Why is Baha’u’llah chosen over Subh I Azali?

Jun 2014
1,111
Wisconsin
bahaullah is not the bab's successor.
bahaullah IS the bab.

i wish more people could be able to actually read the persian bayan, and comprehend many common misconceptions regarding this matter.
Woah, are you able to provide a citation and maybe a translation for that one?? That's very interesting.

What do you mean by "is the Bab"??

Like in the sense of the Biblical Elisha and Elijah, where Elisha, the disciple of Elijah, effectively inherits the prophetic station and becomes Elijah when Elijah is brought up to Heaven??

Or is it more like when Muhammad says "I am Adam, Noah, Moses, and Jesus"??

Or are they the same in some other manner??
 
Mar 2015
246
Bend area, Oregon
That ancient, divine, and universal Reality is the Primal Will, who is the one Primal Will regardless of Its individual and cyclic earthly Manifestations.

Consider Bahá’u’lláh’s words: “Praise be to Thee, O Lord My God, for the wondrous revelations of Thy inscrutable decree and the manifold woes and trials Thou hast destined for Myself. At one time Thou didst deliver Me into the hands of Nimrod; at another Thou hast allowed Pharaoh’s rod to persecute Me. Thou, alone, canst estimate, through Thine all-encompassing knowledge and the operation of Thy Will, the incalculable afflictions I have suffered at their hands. Again Thou didst cast Me into the prison-cell of the ungodly, for no reason except that I was moved to whisper into the ears of the well-favored denizens of Thy Kingdom an intimation of the vision with which Thou hadst, through Thy knowledge, inspired Me, and revealed to Me its meaning through the potency of Thy might. And again Thou didst decree that I be beheaded by the sword of the infidel. Again I was crucified for having unveiled to men’s eyes the hidden gems of Thy glorious unity, for having revealed to them the wondrous signs of Thy sovereign and everlasting power. How bitter the humiliations heaped upon Me, in a subsequent age, on the plain of Karbilá! How lonely did I feel amidst Thy people! To what a state of helplessness I was reduced in that land! Unsatisfied with such indignities, My persecutors decapitated Me, and, carrying aloft My head from land to land paraded it before the gaze of the unbelieving multitude, and deposited it on the seats of the perverse and faithless. In a later age, I was suspended, and My breast was made a target to the darts of the malicious cruelty of My foes. My limbs were riddled with bullets, and My body was torn asunder. Finally, behold how, in this Day, My treacherous enemies have leagued themselves against Me, and are continually plotting to instill the venom of hate and malice into the souls of Thy servants. With all their might they are scheming to accomplish their purpose…. Grievous as is My plight, O God, My Well-Beloved, I render thanks unto Thee, and My Spirit is grateful for whatsoever hath befallen me in the path of Thy good-pleasure. I am well pleased with that which Thou didst ordain for Me, and welcome, however calamitous, the pains and sorrows I am made to suffer.” (Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, XXXIX)

Shoghi Effendi explains and quotes Bahá’u’lláh, “The short duration of His (the Báb’s) Dispensation, the restricted range within which His laws and ordinances have been made to operate, supply no criterion whatever wherewith to judge its Divine origin and to evaluate the potency of its message. ‘That so brief a span,’ Bahá’u’lláh Himself explains, ‘should have separated this most mighty and wondrous Revelation from Mine own previous Manifestation, is a secret that no man can unravel and a mystery such as no mind can fathom. Its duration had been foreordained, and no man shall ever discover its reason unless and until he be informed of the contents of My Hidden Book.’” (The Dispensation of Bahá’u’lláh – chapter on the Báb; The World Order of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 123-124)

-LR
 
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Mar 2015
246
Bend area, Oregon
Onlyoneatall:

You are of the position, "I don’t believe that the Bab envisioned Baha’u’llah at all. What can you offer to support that assertion?" As you have already closed the door of receptivity then why is it you are asking those questions (seemingly lacking sincerity and openness) in the first place?

You have stated on another thread, "Or it’s all horse shit, who cares." I, for one, do not care to play in that pile with you. If there is really any sincere search left in you, then may you be guided in it.

Take the greatest care. -LR
 
Apr 2018
24
Ontario
Onlyoneatall:

You are of the position, "I don’t believe that the Bab envisioned Baha’u’llah at all. What can you offer to support that assertion?" As you have already closed the door of receptivity then why is it you are asking those questions (seemingly lacking sincerity and openness) in the first place?

You have stated on another thread, "Or it’s all horse shit, who cares." I, for one, do not care to play in that pile with you. If there is really any sincere search left in you, then may you be guided in it.

Take the greatest care. -LR
Wow, sorry buddy! I thought you were new to the Baha’i Faith with your misunderstandings about the Bab. Have you even picked up a Baha’i Book before?
 
Apr 2011
1,102
Hyrule
"This, verily, is that which We promised thee, ere the moment We answered thy call. Wait thou until nine will have elapsed from the time of the Bayan. Then exclaim: 'Blessed be God, the most excellent of Makers!' We also answered aforetime, that ever the year Ta (9), it behooveth that two signs from the past, revealed by God in the Book, would be manifested in the year Vav (6). One of them is the prophet Yahya (John), and the other is the Son of Ali, the true and exalted Imam."
-The Bab, Panj Sha'n
 
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Sep 2010
4,622
Normanton, Far North West Queensland
Certainly it's not correct to say that was the whole message of a Prophet of God.
Yes and no :)

"Ye have, one and all, been called into being to seek His presence and to attain that exalted and glorious station. Indeed, He will send down from the heaven of His mercy that which will benefit you, and whatever is graciously vouchsafed by Him shall enable you to dispense with all mankind......"

"...Beware, O concourse of Mirrors, lest on that Day titles make you vainglorious. Know ye of a certainty that ye, together with all those who stand above you or below you, have been created for that Day...."

"...It behooveth you to await the Day of the appearance of Him Whom God shall manifest. Indeed My aim in planting the Tree of the Bayán hath been none other than to enable you to recognize Me. In truth I Myself am the first to bow down before God and to believe in Him. Therefore let not your recognition become fruitless, inasmuch as the Bayán, notwithstanding the sublimity of its station, beareth fealty to Him Whom God shall make manifest, and it is He Who beseemeth most to be acclaimed as the Seat of divine Reality, though indeed He is I and I am He. However, when the Tree of the Bayán attaineth its highest development, We shall bend it low as a token of adoration towards its Lord Who will appear in the person of Him Whom God shall make manifest. Perchance ye may be privileged to glorify God as it befitteth His august Self...."

"..O congregation of the Bayán, and all who are therein! Recognize ye the limits imposed upon you, for such a One as the Point of the Bayán Himself hath believed in Him Whom God shall make manifest, before all things were created. Therein, verily, do I glory before all who are in the kingdom of heaven and earth. Suffer not yourselves to be shut out as by a veil from God after He hath revealed Himself. For all that hath been exalted in the Bayán is but as a ring upon My hand, and I Myself am, verily, but a ring upon the hand of Him Whom God shall make manifest—glorified be His mention! He turneth it as He pleaseth, for whatsoever He pleaseth, and through whatsoever He pleaseth. He, verily, is the Help in Peril, the Most High...."

On the other Hand, the Bab was an independent Messenger from God with a divinely given dispensation, albeit short, to which Baha'u'llah as written much about.

Regards Tony